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      11-15-2011, 06:58 PM   #45
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maybe they have 100 cars pre-sold, I don't see how people would spend that type of money on something that still needs gas to go further... and here in Canada I checked and dealer has 5 available in stock, i don't know what you talking about

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SO now you're comparing a chevy to a BMW in the premium market? Of course you don't see any in Toronto, they haven't been available for sale there. GM only released them in about six states here in the US because they couldn't make them fast enough for a full release. Most people here in the states have had them on order for over a year before they get it. They are all pre-sold.

Still- I never brought up the Volt, most Chevy customers aren't used to paying 40k+ unless it's a huge SUV or a Vette. BMW customers are, it's a premium brand. Maybe you don't factor in sustainability when you look at your next vehicle but whether or not you believe me there are a lot of people that do and that segment is growing. Why do you think BMW is right now installing a wind farm to power the Lepzig plant or why they are built their carbon fiber plant in Lake Moses, WA which uses 100% hydro power for all of it's electricity. Why do you think they are starting to use recycled materials for vehicle interiors? BMW is one hell of a smart company, they know where the market is going. Recently, BMW CEO Dr. Norbert Reithofer said "In the future, premium will also be defined by sustainability" These two cars are the start of that philosophy.
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      11-15-2011, 10:03 PM   #46
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maybe they have 100 cars pre-sold, I don't see how people would spend that type of money on something that still needs gas to go further... and here in Canada I checked and dealer has 5 available in stock, i don't know what you talking about
I didn't know they started selling the volt in Canada yet, sorry. Here in the US it's still not available in every state(less than half) and people are flying to states that do have it and driving it home. Demand has died down a bit, but still outpaces the supply and in the beginning(last spring) there were about 10,000 people that had advanced reservations and waited up to 8 months to get theirs. People were paying $5,000 OVER MSRP (Crazy, I would never I don't care hot limited supply it was) and driving across states to get one. GM just told the dealers they could sell their mandated demos (GM made the dealers keep one in stock as a demo for test drives) because they cannot make them fast enough to keep up with the orders. Here is a link about it: http://www.freep.com/article/2011110...s-trail-demand

BMW is publicly saying they plan on selling 30,000 i3's per year, but privately many in the company think the number will be closer to 50,000. We'll see when they hit the showrooms in 2013.
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      11-15-2011, 11:34 PM   #47
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yah that's crazy, fuel saving must be huge if they're selling out like that...

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I didn't know they started selling the volt in Canada yet, sorry. Here in the US it's still not available in every state(less than half) and people are flying to states that do have it and driving it home. Demand has died down a bit, but still outpaces the supply and in the beginning(last spring) there were about 10,000 people that had advanced reservations and waited up to 8 months to get theirs. People were paying $5,000 OVER MSRP (Crazy, I would never I don't care hot limited supply it was) and driving across states to get one. GM just told the dealers they could sell their mandated demos (GM made the dealers keep one in stock as a demo for test drives) because they cannot make them fast enough to keep up with the orders. Here is a link about it: http://www.freep.com/article/2011110...s-trail-demand

BMW is publicly saying they plan on selling 30,000 i3's per year, but privately many in the company think the number will be closer to 50,000. We'll see when they hit the showrooms in 2013.
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      11-16-2011, 10:19 AM   #48
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yah that's crazy, fuel saving must be huge if they're selling out like that...
If they don't typically drive much more than 40 miles a day, then yes the fuel savings will be substantial with a volt, but still won't really pay back the cost of the car. If economics & fuel savings was you #1 priority, than buy a Honda fit for 12K and get 40mpg.
Buying a car is mostly an emotional decision and everybody has their own reasons & agenda. If it were purely a logical decision then perhaps BMW's wouldn't be as popular as they are. You could find a comparable sedan for half the price that gets better gas mileage than a 5 series, but it won't offer the luxury, performance & style that some people want.

It's kind of the same thing with the new wave of plug in cars. I've been an automobile enthusiast for years and have owned many high performance vehicles. However, recently I'm thinking a bit differently than I used to , and sustainability has become more important to me. I don't preach that it should be more important to you and I want you to be able to buy a car that gets 20mpg if you want to, it's just that it is important to me. I don't want to buy foreign oil if I don't have to. Plugging in my car and using domestic electricity (or electricity that I generate on my rooftop solar array) gives me a good feeling and I'll pay extra for my car if it allows me to do so. Again, I'm not telling anyone else they need to think the way I do, we should all have the freedom to buy whatever car we want and can afford.

Plug in cars like the MINI-E I drive and the BMW ActiveE I'll be getting in a couple weeks are fun to drive and suit my needs just fine. I have 70,000 miles on my MINI-E after only 30 months of driving and fueling it cost me under $3,000, buying gas for that time would have cost me close to $9,000. There is no routine maintenance on EV's so all I've had to do is swap the tires three times and wiper blades. So in addition to being a fun car to drive it is extremely efficient and I know none of my energy dollars have gone to radical Middle Eastern regimes that hate the West. (yes I know we don't get all our oil from the Middle East, but I don't want a penny of my money going there)
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      11-16-2011, 11:59 AM   #49
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ew the i3 looks like a suzuki .. hhhheeeeeeck nooo
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      12-05-2011, 09:13 PM   #50
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