BMW i
Forum for the BMW i3, i4 and i8
BMW i3 BMW i8
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   BMW i Forums > BMW i8 Forums > BMW i8 General Discussion

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-24-2012, 01:35 PM   #67
southlight
Moderator / European Editor
southlight's Avatar
607
Rep
6,748
Posts

 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Germany

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
I don't always agree with your view but I am in full agreement with this i8- it is an entirely different animal and should not be judged by the past "super cars". I say "super cars" in quotes bc if the R8 is one, then so is the M3.

This is a new product establishing a new market- Porsche quickly followed and will have on hell of a alternative super car of their own. BMW best do a little more R&D to give this thing a little more umph or it may be a two year wonder and then fall on its face- I say that as a fan. The problem is- to quote Ricky Bobby "I f you ain't first you're last" that goes for being first to market and first for performance; the first to market is always surpassed by the fastest unless it is close and the Porsche is going to be a beast although a little less "green".

/M
You're not seriously comparing the i8 to the 918, are you?


Best regards,
south
__________________
Those forums...WHY NOT?


JOIN THE 6MT CLUB GROUP
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 01:36 PM   #68
Pangloss
Lieutenant
Pangloss's Avatar
6
Rep
563
Posts

 
Drives: 2012 135i Convertible
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: South Florida

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diver View Post
The 104 mpg is BS. It is based on CO2 output with the assumption none or very little of the electricity is generated from burning coal. It's just a government trick to push electric cars.
No it isn't. It's based on projected electrical energy cost at an average rate.

As to whether it is "BS", it's a valid observation, but it is no more BS than standard EPA MPG ratings. There's a reason the dealer says "your mileage may vary".
__________________
2012 135i convertible, DCT, Black/Beige, HK, Prem, M sport, no nav.
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 01:53 PM   #69
mapezzul
Special Agent
mapezzul's Avatar
United_States
26
Rep
1,737
Posts

 
Drives: Depends on the day!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bavaria

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
You're not seriously comparing the i8 to the 918, are you?


Best regards,
south
Not in the sense they are competitors as they obviously are not. Price point alone is going to be an astronomical difference. The general consumer market is quick to follow the leader- BMW will be first with the higher end, "born electric" BMWi brand. That is great. Much like Toyota with the Prius the i8 will be a star in Hollywood. The issue then will be that the Porsche is "better" sure it costs more but it is a true "halo" and Porsche is also working on a cheaper mainstream (by Porsche standards) car to compete more in line with the i8 but that is at least 4 years out after the i8 launch. So at that point the i8 will be dated even with an LCI as with these electric cars, much like consumer electronics computers etc- the moment you drop the money it is obsolete. BMW is making this as upgradable as possible but at what cost to early adopters, residuals and the wait and see mentality.

If BMW was to give the i8 a bit more performance at the sacrifice of MPG it would better serve those looking for a "halo" car. BMWi is about efficiency but it does not need to blow things out of proportion, they must find the happy medium as currently there is next to nothing efficient in this class of cars- TESLA doesn't count to me as BMWi is not being shoehorned.

I love the i8 as is but with 10,000 sales as the goal they are going to need to approximate the desires of the masses- lawyers/doctors/brokers etc. that want to drive this rather than a 911 or Ferrari to show they have money, speed and EFFICIENCY.

Marketing and final output is going to be real interesting.

I still think that CAR is off in this prediction- they guessed wrong with the M5, M6 where we and others were spot on... the number they have is not the same as what I have heard whispered.
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 02:13 PM   #70
ZStig
Major General
101
Rep
7,248
Posts

 
Drives: VT2-525 M Roadster
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Delray Beach, FL

iTrader: (3)

Are people serious about applauding the sound of it? Sounds like a tractor to me

Oh, and there's already a fast electric car on the market (albeit with some issues), the Tesla Roadster
__________________
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 02:35 PM   #71
bimmerjph
Lieutenant Colonel
bimmerjph's Avatar
United_States
29
Rep
1,978
Posts

 
Drives: 2002 BMW 325i
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Tennessee

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pangloss View Post
Why?
Because its a lot harder to balance acceleration, top speed, and efficiency with a small amount of gear ratios. Which would make it pointless to have a hybrid sports car. I'm not saying its impossible, but that news is a little discouraging.


Quote:
You would be sure if you had read the opening post or any of the replies that discussed the engine.
Whats up with the attitude? JasonCSU said "High torque diesel engines and electric motors don't necessarily need 8+ speed transmissions like their petrol engine counterparts." I was just saying that it dosn't have a diesel.
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 03:14 PM   #72
EdM5
Major
EdM5's Avatar
Netherlands
27
Rep
1,417
Posts

 
Drives: F10 M5 CP & E70 X5 Xdrive35d
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Amsterdam

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
Actually they don't. Look at the R8 and SLS AMG today , they are yesterdays cars. There 15 minutes are up,
15 minutes, right?
The R8 transformed the image of the Audi brand. The SLS got Merc back in Ferrari territory.

OT: I do agree that the i8 could be a brilliant innovative new direction by BMW.
__________________
2004 e87 118d (ret.), 2006 e92 335d (ret.), 2007 e92 330d (ret.), 2007 e87 130i M-sport (ret.), 2009 e92 M3 (ret.), 2010 f10 535d M-sport (ret.)
2009 e70 X5 35d & 2014 f10 M5 CP
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 03:58 PM   #73
Singletrack
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
Singletrack's Avatar
United_States
43
Rep
3,820
Posts

 
Drives: 09 SSII E92 M3; 12 AW X5d
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diver View Post
The 104 mpg is BS. It is based on CO2 output with the assumption none or very little of the electricity is generated from burning coal. It's just a government trick to push electric cars.
You are talking about two separate things.

MPG - refers to how many miles the car can go per gallon of gas.

Whether it is clean energy is a separate topic. But, nowhere in that release do they talk about carbon footprints or total pollution, etc. I agree that electric vehicles are not "green"; at least in the US. The energy and pollution required to manufacture and, ultimately, recycle their batteries is not well publicized either.

You can't blame BMW to responding to the electric kool-aid. Cleaning up the US grid is the US's responsibility, not BMW's.

Last edited by Singletrack; 03-24-2012 at 04:03 PM.
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 03:59 PM   #74
SCOTT26
Brigadier General
SCOTT26's Avatar
311
Rep
3,239
Posts

 
Drives: Frozen Dark Silver 30 Jahre
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: WORLDWIDE

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by EdwinF10 View Post
15 minutes, right?
The R8 transformed the image of the Audi brand. The SLS got Merc back in Ferrari territory.

OT: I do agree that the i8 could be a brilliant innovative new direction by BMW.
Touché. But everybody in the industry knows what the R8 truly is - A Lamborghini in an Audi dress . It might have attained an image for Audi. But Audi remains a cross-dressing brand. Audi is a bit like a French restaurant "The proof is in the eating" and the majority of Audi's on the back of the R8 have been pretty average at best.
In Geneva - an Audi marketing counterpart mentioned briefly the reports to the next M3 returning to a six when the RS 4 is a V8.

In the industry we normally do our "Back stabbing" walking from stand-stand.
The RS 4 might have a V8 but it is still an A4. Like the RS 5 is still an A5 and still is not even close to the current E92 M3. The new F31 is again like the sedan counterpart going to leave the A4 Avant behind. And just to make another point - The E91 still does too.

The SLS AMG is perhaps the best looking Mercedes-Benz today , clean and very efficient in design simplicity. The launch of the SLS AMG came at the same time as the Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ferrari received the plaudits over the SLS AMG as was expected. It might have taken Mercedes-Benz back to Ferrari territory but it still is no Ferrari. I give credit, as the SLS AMG is a better car than the SLR-McLaren Disco Express - An automotive equivalent of a twelve-inch remix no-one wanted , again lost between the Carerra GT and the Ferrari Enzo.
__________________
Electrified
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 05:15 PM   #75
leetennis
Lieutenant
10
Rep
517
Posts

 
Drives: 3 M Sport
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: kent

iTrader: (0)

BMW i8 will be a halo car.
It's making electric cars practical for every day usage.
However much I hate to say it, it's bye bye soot chuckers, bye bye v12's and bye bye bhp race.

Electricity can still work in a drivers car, instant throttle response, greater efforts towards weight reduction and we are already listening to synthetic noises in the cockpit thanks to the m5. Changing times, could be cool
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 05:29 PM   #76
antzcrashing
... can I get a 1M
antzcrashing's Avatar
13
Rep
1,109
Posts

 
Drives: 2006 330i
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Miami FL

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2006 BMW 330i  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post

You can't blame BMW to responding to the electric kool-aid. Cleaning up the US grid is the US's responsibility, not BMW's.
You make it sound like BMW is trying to single-handedly solve the US fuel efficiency battle. That is ridiculous. BMW is continuing to do what they do best, make money - the sole purpose of a business. They see a demand that is not being fulfilled, that of the hybrid supercar and they stepped in, and delivered. Which, as it is an uncharted teritory, it is extremely ballsy.

And as much as I dream of R8, and would purchase it over the i8, I agree with Scott, the v10 supercar has been done before.

BMW is doing something never attempted before by a major car mfg (Tesla is seen by many consumers as a risky venture company).
__________________
Appreciate 0
      03-24-2012, 07:47 PM   #77
Singletrack
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
Singletrack's Avatar
United_States
43
Rep
3,820
Posts

 
Drives: 09 SSII E92 M3; 12 AW X5d
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
You make it sound like BMW is trying to single-handedly solve the US fuel efficiency battle. That is ridiculous. BMW is continuing to do what they do best, make money - the sole purpose of a business. They see a demand that is not being fulfilled, that of the hybrid supercar and they stepped in, and delivered. Which, as it is an uncharted teritory, it is extremely ballsy.

And as much as I dream of R8, and would purchase it over the i8, I agree with Scott, the v10 supercar has been done before.

BMW is doing something never attempted before by a major car mfg (Tesla is seen by many consumers as a risky venture company).
You have totally misread my post.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 01:51 AM   #78
Cdnrockies
Banned
Canada
18
Rep
1,113
Posts

 
Drives: BMW's
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Calgary

iTrader: (0)

Hilarious to listen to "halo car" get thrown around on a BMW board.

They don't have one now, they have never had one (no...the M1 doesn't count since Lambo designed and built the originals), and they still won't when the i8 arrives either.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 02:57 AM   #79
M3_WC
Colonel
29
Rep
2,242
Posts

 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dlbrooks18 View Post
Wow, 104mpg nice!!
Interested to see what the EPA says mpg is. They do some weird math when figuring out plugin/hybrid and electric cars.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 05:12 AM   #80
Rolitto
Second Lieutenant
Rolitto's Avatar
Lebanon
2
Rep
255
Posts

 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Beirut and Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
I'm not impressed.

4.9 is a joke. I don't give a f- about MPG.

10,000 units for a halo car are way too much, it's not very exclusive.

I've asked the VP's at M and some of their engineers when I visited M in Munich last summer. They said it would "defeat the purpose of the i8".
I kind of agree with you on the mpg. I don't give a $hit too about economy. Give me a BMW which does 1mpg but has a sound to die for, is exclusive, and awesome to ride.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 07:57 AM   #81
bimmerJP
First Lieutenant
bimmerJP's Avatar
United_States
3
Rep
376
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 e90 335i
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas, the United States of America, Planet Earth, Universe

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 BMW 335i  [2.50]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diver View Post
The 104 mpg is BS. It is based on CO2 output with the assumption none or very little of the electricity is generated from burning coal. It's just a government trick to push electric cars.
I agree and disagree with you. I agree because there is really no clean energy in the US. It is really sad that our government is in a business with those oil companies... I am disappointed that the politicians are really just politicians. They only want two things: votes and cash.

Anyway, I also disagree with you because in Europe and Canada, there are a lot of renewable energies. Wind power, solar power, ocean power, etc. No, the technologies are still not mature yet, but I totally encourage it because if we, the human kind, don't even try to develop it, then it will never have progress. I also hope that American can follow those "leaders" very soon.

The question about i8 is the battery it uses. I remember that I read an article about the electric cars' battery. Most hybrid cars(Prius) use one single huge battery. The problem is that after 5 years when the battery need to be changed, it is hard to recycle the battery which is totally not green. In another article, it says that BMWi is using a different kind of technology. I think it combines a lot of smaller size batteries into one battery so it can be recycle easily. It is a little bit like... MacBook Air's battery? I don't know. Maybe I remember it wrong, so don't start a fight over this.

I just hope that i8 is a truly green vehicle so that it can be a leader/model in the industry.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 08:00 AM   #82
bimmerJP
First Lieutenant
bimmerJP's Avatar
United_States
3
Rep
376
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 e90 335i
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas, the United States of America, Planet Earth, Universe

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 BMW 335i  [2.50]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cdnrockies View Post
Hilarious to listen to "halo car" get thrown around on a BMW board.

They don't have one now, they have never had one (no...the M1 doesn't count since Lambo designed and built the originals), and they still won't when the i8 arrives either.
Uh... Lambo started, but then they quit. If I remember it right, the M1 was a 100% Bavarian. Well, almost 100% maybe because BMW finished the project on their own. And then ///M Power was born!
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 10:05 AM   #83
3s-a-charm
Major
3s-a-charm's Avatar
Canada
17
Rep
1,160
Posts

 
Drives: 13 E70 X5 3.5i M-Sport
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Calgary, Canada

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
2007 BMW X5  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdwinF10 View Post
15 minutes, right?
The R8 transformed the image of the Audi brand. The SLS got Merc back in Ferrari territory.

OT: I do agree that the i8 could be a brilliant innovative new direction by BMW.
Touché. But everybody in the industry knows what the R8 truly is - A Lamborghini in an Audi dress . It might have attained an image for Audi. But Audi remains a cross-dressing brand. Audi is a bit like a French restaurant "The proof is in the eating" and the majority of Audi's on the back of the R8 have been pretty average at best.
In Geneva - an Audi marketing counterpart mentioned briefly the reports to the next M3 returning to a six when the RS 4 is a V8.

In the industry we normally do our "Back stabbing" walking from stand-stand.
The RS 4 might have a V8 but it is still an A4. Like the RS 5 is still an A5 and still is not even close to the current E92 M3. The new F31 is again like the sedan counterpart going to leave the A4 Avant behind. And just to make another point - The E91 still does too.

The SLS AMG is perhaps the best looking Mercedes-Benz today , clean and very efficient in design simplicity. The launch of the SLS AMG came at the same time as the Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ferrari received the plaudits over the SLS AMG as was expected. It might have taken Mercedes-Benz back to Ferrari territory but it still is no Ferrari. I give credit, as the SLS AMG is a better car than the SLR-McLaren Disco Express - An automotive equivalent of a twelve-inch remix no-one wanted , again lost between the Carerra GT and the Ferrari Enzo.
Wow, Scott! You're getting more and more opinionated lately... Not saying I don't mind. Most representatives of a brand (official or unofficial) prefer to re-divert the topic back to their own brand rather than calling others "cross-dressers" (even if it may be true).

As for the i brand - BMW has taken on a monumental task with this. BMW has already convinced the world that is builds a driver's car - and enjoys tremendous success with that. Now BMW is trying to be known as having an distinct fleet of the most efficient-yet-dynamic vehicles. Where the world has truly pointed out that it appreciates a driver's car, it will be interesting to see if the world is looking for efficient dynamics yet. Many "green-initiative" makers have tried efficient cars by way of electric vehicles (Toyota somewhat pioneered here with useable - and marketable - hybrids) but with the much anticipated and yet seemingly lackluster launch of the Volt and even the Karma and Tesla, it seems to me the world (aka the Consumer) is saying they love the idea but when shopping they would rather stick to what they know best.

It's a terrific endeavor and quite a gamble on BMW's part and I sincerely hope they can pull it off... If not this go-around then in 2050 when it becomes so important that consumers won't have a choice and BMW will be known as having "cool" efficient vehicles.
__________________

13 X5 xDrive 35i M-Sport Black/Oyster (Hers)
07 X5 4.8i Sport Black/Black (Winter/DD)
03.5 M3 Cabriolet Steel Grey on Black (Summer Fun)
PAST: 08 E92 M3, 08 535xiT, 06 E90 325i, 87 E30 325i, 85 E30 318i
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 10:11 AM   #84
Cdnrockies
Banned
Canada
18
Rep
1,113
Posts

 
Drives: BMW's
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Calgary

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrypon83 View Post
Uh... Lambo started, but then they quit. If I remember it right, the M1 was a 100% Bavarian. Well, almost 100% maybe because BMW finished the project on their own. And then ///M Power was born!
Ya...ummm...nope.

Lambo built the prototypes and BMW took over when Lambo ran out of money.

Quote:
Initially, BMW turned to Lamborghini to sort out the details of the tubular steel chassis, build prototypes and assemble the 400 road cars required for homologation at the rate of two a week. Giugiaro's Ital Design was contracted to shape the body, taking inspiration from Paul Bracq's 1972 BMW Turbo show car. Prototypes were seen being tested around Sant'Agata in 1977, but by then Lamborghini was in deep financial trouble- and the Ml looked like a possible casualty. Lamborghini's government funding ran out, and delays caused BMW to snatch its Ml project back in April 1978, by which time seven prototypes had been built. It decided to transfer production to Baur, in Stuttgart.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 10:43 PM   #85
BMWBoss
Lieutenant
United_States
4
Rep
474
Posts

 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: New Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 BMW M3  [0.00]
I commend BMW for taking initiative and making such a "green" car. However, I would never buy it. I'm not spending $100K+ for MPG...I'd rather buy a Volt if I care so much about MPG and save myself a hell of a lot of money.
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 10:46 PM   #86
BMWBoss
Lieutenant
United_States
4
Rep
474
Posts

 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: New Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 BMW M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
are you guys serious? When you buy a car north of 100K you want something exotic, something different, something never been done before - this car gives you that - supercar speed and top hybrid technology, MPG to brag about to your neighbor who can't achieve 14 MPG in his Ferrari. This is a car for the super rich. It is not anyones only 100K car, it goes in a collection of cars, maybe to be driven every 15th weekend in the rotation. That is why they project 10K sales, very few can truly afford it.
Supercar speed?? Seriously???
Appreciate 0
      03-25-2012, 11:06 PM   #87
Singletrack
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
Singletrack's Avatar
United_States
43
Rep
3,820
Posts

 
Drives: 09 SSII E92 M3; 12 AW X5d
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWBoss View Post
I commend BMW for taking initiative and making such a "green" car. However, I would never buy it. I'm not spending $100K+ for MPG...I'd rather buy a Volt if I care so much about MPG and save myself a hell of a lot of money.
You already bought a volt...

...and another

.......and another
Appreciate 0
      03-26-2012, 03:27 AM   #88
Alpina_B3_Lux
Colonel
Alpina_B3_Lux's Avatar
Germany
63
Rep
2,451
Posts

 
Drives: Audi R8 V10, BMW 330d E91 LCI
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Germany

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 335i  [4.39]
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
Actually they don't. Look at the R8 and SLS AMG today , they are yesterdays cars. There 15 minutes are up, Even the Bugatti douchebag has become almost a characterture with its endless "fools are parted easily with their money 2 Million euro +, ltd editions"
You're missing the point. Whether it's an R8/SLS or F12 Berlinetta competitor, the point is BMW is selling itself as being a particularly sportive brand but they do not have a super sports car in their product portfolio, in spite of every other premium brand having one.

And the M6 certainly isn't it, it's just an overweight Gran Turismo car.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The hot sports car of the moment is the Ferrari F12 Berlinetta and rightly so because in the flesh it is beautiful it is everything a Ferrari should be. At Geneva I mentioned to a fellow counterpart at Ferrari about the Lambo SUV and whether Ferrari would follow? I was told in this very cutting answer no because "We are Italian!, Lamborghini is German".
Ferrari already made an SUV. It's called the FF and the most ugly Ferrari I have every laid eyes upon. Interestingly from a BMW standpoint they were apparently inspired by the flattened-bug-look of the Z4 Coupé that fortunately is not produced anymore.

Alpina_B3_Lux
__________________
Audi R8 V10; sold: BMW 335i
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
2014 bmw i8, 2014 i8, 2015 bmw i8, 2015 i8, bmw i forum, bmw i forums, bmw i8 0-60, bmw i8 forum, bmw i8 forums, bmw i8 mileage, bmw i8 mpg, bmw i8 performance, bmw i8 price, bmw i8 prices, bmw i8 pricing, bmw i8 specs, bmw i8 torque, i forum, i forums, i8 forum, i8 forums, i8 mileage, i8 mpg, i8 specs

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:24 AM.




bmw
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST