[afadeev]

Model 3 specs are out:

$35K base price (before $7.5K Fed and state discounts, some of which may expire).
215 mile range for base model
Full autonomous driving support
Seating for 5 adults
0-60 in 5.x seconds (beats most 3-series/A4 Audi/C-class Merc models)

Higher battery capacity and performance AWD options will have:
300+ mile range
0-60 in 3.x seconds (beats ///M3 and C63s AMG)


Model 3 will not only devour i3 sales, but will take a huge bite out of 3-series/A4 Audi/C-class Merc luxury segment sales.

It will be my next EV!

a

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by afadeev

Model 3 specs are out:

$35K base price (before $7.5K Fed and state discounts, some of which may expire).
215 mile range for base model
Full autonomous driving support
Seating for 5 adults
0-60 in 5.x seconds (beats most 3-series/A4 Audi/C-class Merc models)

Higher battery capacity and performance AWD options will have:
300+ mile range
0-60 in 3.x seconds (beats ///M3 and C63s AMG)


Model 3 will not only devour i3 sales, but will take a huge bite out of 3-series/A4 Audi/C-class Merc luxury segment sales.

It will be my next EV!

a

Yes indeed.

i-Next? That is the largest question of them all.

[-c-]

Isn't competition grand, we get to sit back and let the oem's go at it and make more kick ass cars to try and best one another.

Still though one thing I really like about the i3 though is the fact the body and frame will never rust, since I'm in the rust belt and keep my cars for 20yrs plus that's a big deal. . Still though BMW is gonna have to bring the rain if they don't want to be left behind. Awsome materials and stuff will only get you so far, now give the customer something they can use, awesome best in class range and performance tee hee !

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by -c-

Isn't competition grand, we get to sit back and let the oem's go at it and make more kick ass cars to try and best one another.

Still though one thing I really like about the i3 though is the fact the body and frame will never rust, since I'm in the rust belt and keep my cars for 20yrs plus that's a big deal. . Still though BMW is gonna have to bring the rain if they don't want to be left behind. Awsome materials and stuff will only get you so far, now give the customer something they can use, awesome best in class range and performance tee hee !

BMW better get cracking.

Model 3D is going to be a uber quick car.

[plymjack]

indeed Spec is very grand, (its also April 1st) .- if it did ship to UK @ £23500 then indeed it could do very well - BUT (yes a big but) - its not going to arrive here till 2018 I guess and will it have that range and price?

[-c-]

Yea BMW already has the tech they just need to exercise it.

Can't say I love the dead pool like face but it could grow on me

Like the side surfaces though. May look completely different in person

[afadeev]

Originally Posted by -c-

Isn't competition grand, we get to sit back and let the oem's go at it and make more kick ass cars to try and best one another.

Indeed!

Originally Posted by -c-

Still though one thing I really like about the i3 though is the fact the body and frame will never rust, since I'm in the rust belt and keep my cars for 20yrs plus that's a big deal. .

I don't think they revealed whether the body will be mostly aluminum (like Model S), or have more steel content.

Either way, the batteries wont last 20 years ;-(

But that's also where Tesla has the competitive advantage - they had invested in their own battery production manufacturing and R&D, while BMW had invested into carbon fiber body suppliers (useful for ICE and EV cars).

Between the two, battery technology and range are the primary EV differentiators, not body materials (CF).

Originally Posted by -c-

Can't say I love the dead pool like face but it could grow on me
Like the side surfaces though. May look completely different in person

I see nothing to complain about in the Model 3 looks department:
- Front quarter panels borrow design queues from Ferrari or Panamera (with slightly shorter front wheel overhang).
- The slab-inspired nose is courtesy of the European pedestrian safety regulations, and has inflicted all modern makes and model.
- The back end is a bit conservative, and the hatchback profile will take some getting used to, but it works.

https://www.teslamotors.com/model3

a

[-c-]

Originally Posted by afadeev

Indeed!

I don't think they revealed whether the body will be mostly aluminum (like Model S), or have more steel content.

Either way, the batteries wont last 20 years ;-(

But that's also where Tesla has the competitive advantage - they had invested in their own battery production manufacturing and R&D, while BMW had invested into carbon fiber body suppliers (useful for ICE and EV cars).

Between the two, battery technology and range are the primary EV differentiators, not body materials (CF).

I see nothing to complain about in the Model 3 looks department (with slightly shorter front wheel overhang).
- Front quarter panels borrow design queues from Ferrari.
- The slab-inspired nose is courtesy of the European pedestrian safety regulations, and has inflicted all modern makes and model.
- The back end is a bit conservative, and the hatchback profile will take some getting used to, but it works.

https://www.teslamotors.com/model3

a

Yes in an interview with Elon he said to keep the prices down they had to make the body of steel like the current competition of BMW and Audi cars.

Not really a bad but I can see why that direction was chosen.

[-c-]

Originally Posted by afadeev

Indeed!

I don't think they revealed whether the body will be mostly aluminum (like Model S), or have more steel content.

Either way, the batteries wont last 20 years ;-(

But that's also where Tesla has the competitive advantage - they had invested in their own battery production manufacturing and R&D, while BMW had invested into carbon fiber body suppliers (useful for ICE and EV cars).

Between the two, battery technology and range are the primary EV differentiators, not body materials (CF).

I see nothing to complain about in the Model 3 looks department (with slightly shorter front wheel overhang).
- Front quarter panels borrow design queues from Ferrari.
- The slab-inspired nose is courtesy of the European pedestrian safety regulations, and has inflicted all modern makes and model.
- The back end is a bit conservative, and the hatchback profile will take some getting used to, but it works.

https://www.teslamotors.com/model3

a

Again my opinion is that, it's not for me. Not that it's not perfect for you. The more I look at it the older it's looking already and the interior is to Spartan it's becomes very boring.



It's a great car for the money not arguing that in the slightest, and the options are great for a base car. Won't surprise me if a fully optioned one starts creeping into big car territory. Who knows. It's exactly what they need to keep afloat though.

What really sold me on the i3 in the beginning wasn't the design but the fact that when I'm dead and gone the body will still be their and the batteries life span is 20 years and even after 20 years it will have a charge of 75% not bad really ( if their telling the truth) . I was looking for a car that I wouldn't have to replace for over 20 years as early retirement is the plan. I have that with this car, plus the fact it's upgradable (still has to be worked out)
It checked all the boxes. But was a risk nonetheless

As long as tesla uses best manufacturing processes for their steel they shouldn't have a problem.

Maybe it was all the hype but I just wasn't floored with it.

[DRTMGRT]

With only two models in their line-up , you'd think tesla's design would be more appealing. I don't think one person could HONESTLY say that they like the designs overall. The model s looks like a Hyundai Genesis and the model 3 looks like a fetal Aston Martin with duct tape over the front. Granted the i3 isn't exactly a looker, but the design elements are unique.

When BMW decides to focus in more on developing new EVs, and not make a X7-X10 (kidding of course about the X8-X10) I think it will be one of the best EVs around.

[ORIGIN M.]

You need your eyes examined stat.

There are 3 Models now silly.

I HONESTLY LIKE IT!

Originally Posted by DRTMGRT

With only two models in their line-up , you'd think tesla's design would be more appealing. I don't think one person could HONESTLY say that they like the designs overall. The model s looks like a Hyundai Genesis and the model 3 looks like a fetal Aston Martin with duct tape over the front...

[DRTMGRT]

Originally Posted by red-sauerkraut

You need your eyes examined stat.

There are 3 Models now silly.

I HONESTLY LIKE IT!

Dammit ! You're right ha ha minor over sight. But seriously it looks like they forgot to make a design for the front. It could've been so much more. That being said because of the other specs I'd still consider the model 3 once in done with this i3

[afadeev]

Originally Posted by DRTMGRT

With only two models in their line-up , you'd think tesla's design would be more appealing. I don't think one person could HONESTLY say that they like the designs overall. The model s looks like a Hyundai Genesis ...

Just went back to look at the Tesla's:
https://www.teslamotors.com/models

Still can't find much to complain about.
Sealed noses are somewhat unusual, but they are that way for the same reason as in i3's - function driving the form. There is no need to cool the radiator upfront, thus aerodynamics are improved by sealing the unnecessary grill slots.

Remember - Model S has been competing for business against the best premium sedans with top of the line technology and styling from all the usual German competitors: 7-series, S-class, A8, etc. Tesla came out of nowhere to bid for business from some of the most conservative and finicky buyers.

3 years after launch, Model S now leads that market segment in the US outright. At the expense of the established luxury brands.
An unappealing design would never have accomplished that:
http://gas2.org/2016/02/15/tesla-mod...porsche-in-us/

Originally Posted by DRTMGRT

and the model 3 looks like a fetal Aston Martin with duct tape over the front. Granted the i3 isn't exactly a looker, but the design elements are unique.

I love Aston Martin styling. DB10 and DB11 more than Rapide, but still like them all. Anything that looks more like Austin and less like i3 is a winner in my book.
BMW's i3 designers (with competing styling between the front and rear halves of the car) can take their uniqueness straight to special Olympics ...

Originally Posted by DRTMGRT

When BMW decides to focus in more on developing new EVs, and not make a X7-X10 (kidding of course about the X8-X10) I think it will be one of the best EVs around.

Therein lies the rub - I don't think BMW will be in a serious position to compete in the mass market EV space for years to come.
If ever.

Tesla had quickly figured out that they need to develop their own battery supply chain, and broke ground on battery manufacturing and R&D facility (aka gigafactory) 2 years ago. It will double the world's available supply of EV batteries, upto 50 Gwh by 2020:
http://www.fool.com/investing/genera...gafactory.aspx

BMW had instead been investing into mapping (bought out Nokia maps) and CF manufacturing. So it's well positioned to built lighter bodied cars with proprietary nav (benefiting both EV and ICE cars - makes sense), but now has to go begging to Samsung for the latest upgrade for the EV batteries.

It will get some to cover i3 + i8 production run (~20K/year), but nothing of the kind that will be required to scale up for 100-500K/year to keep up with Tesla.

i5 is BMW's rumored answer to Model 3.
Still 4+ years away from reality.
It will be light, and it will map really well, but it may be far too late to the party:
http://www.bmwblog.com/2016/03/16/ne...-launch-2020s/

a

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by DRTMGRT

Dammit ! You're right ha ha minor over sight. But seriously it looks like they forgot to make a design for the front. It could've been so much more. That being said because of the other specs I'd still consider the model 3 once in done with this i3

The front is fine. It is electric, it needs no grill.

215 miles on one charge. 15" info screen. Rear wheel drive.

A exceptional 35K Sports Sedan. No Sales Tax is the Hat-Trick here..!!!

[SteveMondragon]

IMO, no point to really think about it until they hit the road in well over a year from now (could be 2 years). Plus by that time, other EV cars with similar specs will probably be coming out around that same time.

Plus, you know the first Model 3's hitting the early owners are probably going to get flipped for 2x the price all over the web.

[DRTMGRT]

Point taken.

when it comes to aero, it's not always necessary to reduce drag coefficient by sealing it up, there are ways to creatively reduce drag to similar figures whilst remaining aesthetically pleasing.

I'm all for form over function, but to a degree. Plus in a vacuum, in a computer, or in a wind tunnel, there are many variables left out. Designs like the model 3 may not always fare as well as expected in the real world.

[MalibuBimmer]

I don't mean to be a Tesla hater, but the design looks like a junior version of the widely-panned S model. Which itself looks like a rounded off Buick. The interior again lacks acceptable switchgear and instead has an ergonomically awful 15 inch iPad-like touch screen.

Tesla's survival is the biggest question mark. Musk himself said the 3 model will change. So he was showing early prototypes 3 years ahead of time. Why? To try to get investor confidence, bolster the stock price, and allow for another stock issuance to get needed billions to proceed.

Coupled with the electric motor failures and other reliability problems with the S, and the slow delivery of the X, Tesla is probably going to go under by 2018. It will either be bankruptcy or Toyota (or maybe Hyundai) buying it.

That's how I see it.

[-c-]

Originally Posted by MalibuBimmer

I don't mean to be a Tesla hater, but the design looks like a junior version of the widely-panned S model. Which itself looks like a rounded off Buick. The interior again lacks acceptable switchgear and instead has an ergonomically awful 15 inch iPad-like touch screen.

Tesla's survival is the biggest question mark. Musk himself said the 3 model will change. So he was showing early prototypes 3 years ahead of time. Why? To try to get investor confidence, bolster the stock price, and allow for another stock issuance to get needed billions to proceed.

Coupled with the electric motor failures and other reliability problems with the S, and the slow delivery of the X, Tesla is probably going to go under by 2018. It will either be bankruptcy or Toyota (or maybe Hyundai) buying it.

That's how I see it.

Exactly, very good points! In the studio we were all talking and some other points where brought up my chief was saying their not setup for a mass produced car, their current infrastructure won't allow cars at that magnitude to be serviced, their good for a low production car numbers and when they start building big numbers you may have more issues and your going to need lots of shops unless they start building shops everywhere. This will be interesting.

I'm happy that an American startup like teslas seeing such demand but I fear they may get a little ahead of themselves. But they may have a plan, at least I hope they do.

Their 30 billion in red and loosing almost a billion a year, they need something quick.

Design side of things Malibu your spot on, no button controls and no display or even a HUD will be a human factors nightmare! Forcing every action to the iPad in the center for sake of cost will be a very bad thing indeed. It works for a showroom but every day driving it's a nightmare. Also the interior I feel may be just a prototype as the whole thing seems slapped together and does not communicate the exterior design at all. It seems like a freshman interior project or even an interior you find at an auto supplier showcasing their technology. Granted this is all from images but it left me cold. The exterior is just a stubbed version of the S which is ok but getting long in the tooth and when it comes out in a few years it will be even more old looking, kind of like when GM showed the world the solstice years before it was released and by then it was old news and didn't sell well.

I also think either show a grill or design it without one but to show one wanting to bust out if the skin is kind of odd, hence why I called it a dead pool face, it kind of has a ford fusion or Aston grill structure back their, When you see it from head on it looks actually pretty bad. The side view is not bad but the rear is old now. They designed a car that appeals to mass market.

I really wanted to like it as we were thinking of adding it to the stable for my wife but after seeing it I think we will hold off for a while, perhaps we were caught up in the hype and got to excited but whatever it's just a car and it to will be replaced one day by something better.

You can see from straight on it just doesn't say much.

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by MalibuBimmer

I don't mean to be a Tesla hater, but the design looks like a junior version of the widely-panned S model. Which itself looks like a rounded off Buick. The interior again lacks acceptable switchgear and instead has an ergonomically awful 15 inch iPad-like touch screen.

Tesla's survival is the biggest question mark. Musk himself said the 3 model will change. So he was showing early prototypes 3 years ahead of time. Why? To try to get investor confidence, bolster the stock price, and allow for another stock issuance to get needed billions to proceed.

Coupled with the electric motor failures and other reliability problems with the S, and the slow delivery of the X, Tesla is probably going to go under by 2018. It will either be bankruptcy or Toyota (or maybe Hyundai) buying it.

That's how I see it.

You need to give up crack or back away from the crack pipe or a combo of both.

Just because you think all that crap, does not make it so. Tesla Hater,,, that you are!

Musk just raised 7.5B in 3 days. Next /

[-c-]

Originally Posted by red-sauerkraut

You need to give up crack or back away from the crack pipe or a combo of both.

Just because you think all that crap, does not make it so. Tesla Hater,,, that you are!

Musk just raised 7.5B in 3 days. Next /

That's quite possible but we need to see if he can meet the numbers promised, otherwise the backlash can do worlds of harm, just this week their stock slid 14$ due to them still not meeting promised production numbers, now hopefully they have this worked out before the model 3 launch but we will see. With customers waiting already a couple years for their cars don't know if they will wait a few more if they can't handle the full production. With the amount I have tied up in their stock they better meet their promises. We shall see.

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by -c-

That's quite possible but we need to see if he can meet the numbers promised, otherwise the backlash can do worlds of harm, just this week their stock slid 14$ due to them still not meeting promised production numbers, now hopefully they have this worked out before the model 3 launch but we will see. With customers waiting already a couple years for their cars don't know if they will wait a few more if they can't handle the full production. With the amount I have tied up in their stock they better meet their promises. We shall see.

Not a bad stock to buy unless you live in Malibu and need everybody to know it while hating Tesla's on the interweb.

[-c-]

Originally Posted by red-sauerkraut

Not a bad stock to buy unless you live in Malibu and need everybody to know it while hating Tesla's on the interweb.

Lol . Oh come on now can't we all agree to disagree . We are on a BMW forum after all so you will have BMW super fans where everything else is garbage, plus for some strange reason their are people out their that want tesla to fail. I don't have any idea as to why but I've never knew a car company where I've met people where they are simply enamored with them or they have nothing but the worst to say and want them to go under to a startling degree, now I am critical of them as I'm am invested in their company but to me their a great American company that I want to pull through. We need more technology companies like tesla in this country and if they can pull it off then who knows what they will accomplish. Plus what they do pull off only makes the other companies better, the bolt, i3, i8, leaf the whole lot of them will improve because of what they do and we can thank tesla for that, competition to best one another is grand.