Forum for the entire range of BMW electric vehicles
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW i8 Forums BMW i8 General Discussion

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      09-16-2014, 10:36 PM   #1
Paul-Bracq-BMW
Moderator
Paul-Bracq-BMW's Avatar
Australia
4087
Rep
1,973
Posts

Drives: 1981 323i, sports M5, LSD
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

SCANS - 911S, R8 V8 VS i8 (EVO November 2014)

BIMMERPOST
     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com
Enjoy the read!
Attached Images
          
__________________
1981 323i, 143 Kashmir-Metallic, 0094 Pergament, Sports M5, LSD.
Appreciate 0
      09-17-2014, 04:14 PM   #2
JasH
Lieutenant Colonel
JasH's Avatar
United Kingdom
621
Rep
1,646
Posts

Drives: McLaren & Ferrari & i8 & i3
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Kent, UK

iTrader: (0)

Thank you Much appreciated
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 04:59 PM   #3
Diver
Brigadier General
Diver's Avatar
United_States
504
Rep
3,446
Posts

Drives: Black '12 135i - Sold
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Texas

iTrader: (0)

I have been thinking about why the i8 battery gets low on the track and may understand the problem now. The i8 has a 7kwhr battery, about the same as a 918, but the 918 does not run out. My conclusion is energy to charge the battery comes indirectly from the petrol engine as it is temporarily stored as kinetic energy in the moving mass of the vehicle. Because the i8 petrol engine is much smaller than that of the 918 the car is not going as fast on the track when the brakes are applied, so less energy goes back to the battery via regenerative braking. There are also times when not all of the power of the 918's petrol engine is useable on a track so some of the reserve may be directed to charging the battery. In the case of the i8, these medium power portions of the track will be shorter and there is not as much excess power available for battery charging. At first I thought it was about software, but now I realize it is about where the energy comes from in the first place.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 05:10 PM   #4
clbmw
Major
631
Rep
1,483
Posts

Drives: 320d M135i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 05:21 PM   #5
kevinlevrone
Lieutenant
261
Rep
435
Posts

Drives: 335i
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
It's not really ok to compare track numbers between them. The Porsche has 60 more hp and 70 less kg. Plus the i8 has some skinny 215mm rear tires. At least the track numbers difference doesn't come from better chassis engineering from Porsche, but from more power and less weight.

The i8 can be regarded as a pioneer for what's to come.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 05:29 PM   #6
clbmw
Major
631
Rep
1,483
Posts

Drives: 320d M135i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinlevrone
Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
It's not really ok to compare track numbers between them. The Porsche has 60 more hp and 70 less kg. Plus the i8 has some skinny 215mm rear tires. At least the track numbers difference doesn't come from better chassis engineering from Porsche, but from more power and less weight.

The i8 can be regarded as a pioneer for what's to come.
I agree fully, and those who use a car daily and/or have company car tax to pay would likely pick the i8 over the 911 any day... However it begs the question why buy a 100k car to commute? It's a stunning car and it's in its own niche, and I hope we see a lot more of the i cars in future
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 05:30 PM   #7
ynotony
Private First Class
ynotony's Avatar
63
Rep
185
Posts

Drives: Carrera S
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Angeles

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
You could say something similar about Porsche.

The 911 needs to look a lot more striking and improve fuel efficiency by at least 400% if it is to be seen as a true competitor to the i8.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 05:31 PM   #8
clbmw
Major
631
Rep
1,483
Posts

Drives: 320d M135i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ynotony
Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
You could say something similar about Porsche.

The 911 needs to look a lot more striking and improve fuel efficiency by at least 400% if it is to be seen as a true competitor to the i8.
Fair point
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 05:36 PM   #9
DieGrüneHölle
Colonel
1309
Rep
2,787
Posts

Drives: M
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: bmw

iTrader: (0)

Never found the i8 to be a good looking car. It just looks awkward at so many angles.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 06:08 PM   #10
Tilum
Private First Class
United Kingdom
3
Rep
153
Posts

Drives: i8 (on order)
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ynotony View Post
You could say something similar about Porsche.

The 911 needs to look a lot more striking and improve fuel efficiency by at least 400% if it is to be seen as a true competitor to the i8.
Regarding the fuel efficiency, I've just had loan of my dealer's demo i8 for 4 days, and to be honest I am really disappointed by the fuel efficiency and the electric-only range. I knew it was never going to achieve the theoretical 100+mpg, but I expected it to be about 60 mpg UK (50 mpg US) when driven sensibly/economically. But despite 95%+ of the 800 miles being driven in Eco-Pro mode, the average fuel economy I got was only 37mpg UK (31 mpg US)!!!

To put that into context, on the same journeys I used to get about 30mpg UK from my Porsche 981! So the i8's fuel economy is very disappointing

To make matters worse, the max. e-Drive range has dropped to 15 miles (due to the lower outside temperatures), but it's still only about 12-15 deg C outside, so I'm concerned the range will drop to 10-12 miles max. during winter! This will have a considerable impact on the regular short journeys I make, which I had planned to drive solely in e-Drive mode.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 07:24 PM   #11
dmz
Captain
37
Rep
645
Posts

Drives: me nuts
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: CA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinlevrone
Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
It's not really ok to compare track numbers between them. The Porsche has 60 more hp and 70 less kg. Plus the i8 has some skinny 215mm rear tires. At least the track numbers difference doesn't come from better chassis engineering from Porsche, but from more power and less weight.

The i8 can be regarded as a pioneer for what's to come.
Of course we all know that it does not take any engineering to make a lighter and more powerful car.
Not to mention, no engineering is needed to make a rear engined car to be one of the best handling chassis in the world. Lol! But it sure does not even come close of the claimed 135 mpg of the i8 thou...
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 09:58 PM   #12
ChiTownM
Lieutenant Colonel
ChiTownM's Avatar
United_States
1046
Rep
1,533
Posts

Drives: M and i BMWs
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Chicago

iTrader: (0)

This article had an interesting conclusion about the driving thrills of these cars. It reflects the dilemma of the i8. For the price, you need to decide between traditional driving thrills or new age technology that is not matching the sports car driving thrills 100%. I am on the list for the i8 but have my hesitations due to the driving dynamics and battery efficiency in cold weather since I live in Chicago. I won't use it on snowy days but we have plenty of cold days here regardless.

Time will tell how I will decide, but a 911 GTS might be in my future instead.....well it'll be fun to finally get either one. Audi is just not there for me.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2014, 11:46 PM   #13
Carac
Captain
95
Rep
678
Posts

Drives: E30M3, E39M5, SLSAMG, RRS SVR
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiTownM View Post
This article had an interesting conclusion about the driving thrills of these cars. It reflects the dilemma of the i8. For the price, you need to decide between traditional driving thrills or new age technology that is not matching the sports car driving thrills 100%. I am on the list for the i8 but have my hesitations due to the driving dynamics and battery efficiency in cold weather since I live in Chicago. I won't use it on snowy days but we have plenty of cold days here regardless.

Time will tell how I will decide, but a 911 GTS might be in my future instead.....well it'll be fun to finally get either one. Audi is just not there for me.
Yeah, as a proposition for a single car (or single "fun" car home) I can see the i8 not making much sense as a sole source of thrills. As a second or third car it's a much easier pill to swallow since it provides a different type of ownership/driving experience.
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 01:20 AM   #14
Inge_F
Private
43
Rep
63
Posts

Drives: F30 335i MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
Put on some wider tires for track day use, or even everyday use if fuel consumption does not concern you, and lap times would improve significantly. Maybe not 7 secs on this specific track, but still... Play around a bit with the front tire sizes as well and I would think one could sort out most of the understeer too.
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 02:34 AM   #15
clbmw
Major
631
Rep
1,483
Posts

Drives: 320d M135i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inge_F
Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Thanks for sharing. The i8 is stunning, perhaps the best looking car on sale today, but 7 sec behind the Porsche is pretty cavernous. We need BMW to see through to fruition the rumoured i8S and/or i9 in 2016 if i is to be seen as a true competitor to the 911 and beyond.
Put on some wider tires for track day use, or even everyday use if fuel consumption does not concern you, and lap times would improve significantly. Maybe not 7 secs on this specific track, but still... Play around a bit with the front tire sizes as well and I would think one could sort out most of the understeer too.
That's a good point, has anyone tested wider tyres on the i8 yet?
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 05:15 AM   #16
Alpina_B3_Lux
Colonel
Alpina_B3_Lux's Avatar
263
Rep
2,564
Posts

Drives: Audi R8 LMX, BMW M550i xDrive
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Germany

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 335i  [8.90]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inge_F View Post
Put on some wider tires for track day use, or even everyday use if fuel consumption does not concern you, and lap times would improve significantly. Maybe not 7 secs on this specific track, but still... Play around a bit with the front tire sizes as well and I would think one could sort out most of the understeer too.
The i8 is useless as a track car. The battery will be discharged after about 2 minutes of hard driving, and then you're left with a 231hp petrol engine.

It's not conceived at all for the track and one should not even try to make it fit this purpose.

Alpina_B3_Lux
__________________
Audi R8 LMX, BMW M550i xDrive (G30 LCI); gone: Alpina B3 3,3 (E46), BMW 335i, Audi R8 V10 manual, Audi R8 V10, BMW M235i, BMW 550i F10
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 06:17 AM   #17
Inge_F
Private
43
Rep
63
Posts

Drives: F30 335i MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux View Post
The i8 is useless as a track car. The battery will be discharged after about 2 minutes of hard driving, and then you're left with a 231hp petrol engine.

It's not conceived at all for the track and one should not even try to make it fit this purpose.

Alpina_B3_Lux
I haven't driven it yet, probably never will, but to call it useless for track days is a bit harsh don't you think? I don't know the rate its able to regenerate power during braking and partly power-demand situations, but I believe that there will always be some el. power available. And you will always have the possibility to do like one re-charge lap for every two hot-laps for example, like they do in F1 these days. Don't think Lewis H. call his car useless for that reason..
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 07:48 AM   #18
Roundown
Colonel
576
Rep
2,353
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New England

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inge_F View Post
Put on some wider tires for track day use, or even everyday use if fuel consumption does not concern you, and lap times would improve significantly. Maybe not 7 secs on this specific track, but still... Play around a bit with the front tire sizes as well and I would think one could sort out most of the understeer too.
The i8 is useless as a track car. The battery will be discharged after about 2 minutes of hard driving, and then you're left with a 231hp petrol engine.

It's not conceived at all for the track and one should not even try to make it fit this purpose.

Alpina_B3_Lux
This.
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 08:05 AM   #19
NYAWE60
Captain
NYAWE60's Avatar
645
Rep
774
Posts

Drives: 2008 Porsche 911 Turbo 6 speed
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: NYC

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cSurf View Post
This.

This +1
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 08:36 AM   #20
Roundown
Colonel
576
Rep
2,353
Posts

Drives: BMW
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New England

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inge_F
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux View Post
The i8 is useless as a track car. The battery will be discharged after about 2 minutes of hard driving, and then you're left with a 231hp petrol engine.

It's not conceived at all for the track and one should not even try to make it fit this purpose.

Alpina_B3_Lux
I haven't driven it yet, probably never will, but to call it useless for track days is a bit harsh don't you think? I don't know the rate its able to regenerate power during braking and partly power-demand situations, but I believe that there will always be some el. power available. And you will always have the possibility to do like one re-charge lap for every two hot-laps for example, like they do in F1 these days. Don't think Lewis H. call his car useless for that reason..
Hamilton also has a monstrously boosted V6 (that makes ~650hp). His KERs system is good for ~160hp; useful, but not nearly in the same proportion of electrical propulsion as on the i8.
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 09:10 AM   #21
Wolfinwolfsclothing
Banned
37
Rep
1,312
Posts

Drives: E92 ///M3 Coupe
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: B-roads

iTrader: (2)

They didnt need to even compare them to know what the results were. They were predetermined before the comparo even started much like any comparo with a 911.

There's no beating the 911...its basically God and IMO with the R8 are much better looking inside and out. Performance, handling and precision the 911 EASILY wipes the floor with these two cars. Even a base 911 would have though since its the best platform in the world right now short of hypercars. As Porsche always does hold the bar, they raised it to a point where its really unfair for anyone who has to be compared to it or compete with them (in any sgment).

The i8 is one hideous looking car. Its overpriced and underperforming too. Sorry, but wider tires wont account for nearly 7 seconds per lap.
Appreciate 0
      10-30-2014, 09:23 AM   #22
Inge_F
Private
43
Rep
63
Posts

Drives: F30 335i MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Norway

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing View Post
Sorry, but wider tires wont account for nearly 7 seconds per lap.
Sorry, but no one ever claimed that wider tires would account for nearly 7 secs per lap.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:24 PM.




bmw
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST