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      04-28-2013, 05:26 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by gvega702 View Post
If you can afford it, occasionally people do something to benefit society and the planet, rather than just their pocket books.
I love my electric car. I would say I am driving it twice as much as my 2011 BMW. Smooth, instant torque, no gear changes, and absolutely silent. Not to mention I have achieved up to 130mpge. Yes, the costs don't always pen out, but the concept of driving on sunlight is awesome in my opinion. I am in the planning process right now of putting up a $24,000-$30,000 solar system within the next few months. I was absolutely surprised how many Nissan Leaf customers are the same ones buying the $100,000 Tesla and $60K solar systems.

Here is an example of a modern solar installation:

https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/...tems/2Kkg31401

You can see real time production per panel. If you push the play button when looking to today's production, you can see how each panel reacts throughout the day.

An average 250 watt 3.2 ft x 5.5 ft solar panel will put out 1.2-1.3kWh daily in Southern California. My 12 miles of daily driving to/from work would be covered by just 4 panels. Pretty remarkable stuff. Soon as battery technology gets better, the electric car will become more mainstream. The LEAF battery is reported to cost $12000-$18000 to replace, and deteriorates every year. But, as it is, a Tesla S Performance sedan can fit 4 adults, and 2 kids. Has a front hood area with huge storage capacity. cg of only 17" above the ground (same as a Z06). Can run 0-60 in 4.1 second, and low 12 second qtr mile times. Won the Motor Trend Car of the year award, and absolutely stunned Road and Track. R&R stated that without the 640hp Viper (On the front cover of the 4/13 edition) clutching and revving its engine, it would lose in a 5mph-60mph race with the Tesla. And the Tesla does it with an engine the size of a small office trash can nestled between the 2 rear wheels. And it can get 88mpge, or much better efficiency than a Prius. Two of these small motors would be putting out 800+hp and around 900lbs of torque! When battery tech evolves, then we will start seeing some amazing performance numbers. Just look at the top $1M Mclaren P1 and Ferrari coming out. Both have electric motors to boost their performance. The future is going to be fascinating for electric drive technologies.

Even my LEAF has 80,000 watt motor which is quite amazing. 200lbs torque at 0rpm. A Tesla has a 320,000 watt motor (400+lbs tq at 0 rpm). Kind of amazing if you put it in 12volt terms, that would be 6666amps for the LEAF and 26,666 amps for the Tesla. The fast charger on these cars be can deliver over 50000 watts. My LEAF is loaded with heated steering wheel, heated front/rear seats, awesome back up camera, comfort access, sirius radio, home link, streaming bluetooth audio, smart phone apps, LED headlights. Very techie stuff.

I'm enjoying driving my electric car so much, my next BMW will most likely be the i3.

FYI: Here is a video I took while doing a 0-75mph run in the $100K Tesla S. With 3 adults in the car.

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      04-28-2013, 06:12 AM   #24
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Do the math. The square footage of a typical garage roof isn't going to charge jack squat. Like someone said, not much more than keeping the battery topped off. Plus it's going to be 10 times the cost of retail electricity. And unless you work nightshift, it's not going to do most people much good. Pairing this up with the sale of a car is nothing but marketing. If it's a good idea, then do it anyway, even if you don't have an electric car. Economically, it's not a good idea. Which would explain why solar companies are going bankrupt left and right, even with a shitload of government subsidies. Most people who think this kind of stuff is "cool" don't do the math. A coworker has struggled the last few months with a Nissan Leaf. With 120 volt charger in his garage and a 25 mile commute to a 12 hour shift, it was not enough time to completely charge. He could do 2 days in a row, but by the third day, it wasn't charged enough to make the round trip. Better now that he had a 240 volt charger installed, but he's still driving in the cold with no heater, bundled up like he's going skiing, and this summer he'll be sweating his ass off 'cause he won't be using the AC. This stuff just isn't ready for mass consumption yet.
+1. This is just marketing. All this solar power stuff is available today but it is not efficient enough to pay for itself. I do not believe Solarwatt has the formula to make it different. What we will see as a result of this partnership is solar power system with BMW logos on it and perhaps contemporary looking panels. Expect it to be about twice as expensive vs a local solar power supplier/installer for the same power output.
bottom line: The same silly thing as buying winter tires from BMW, but some people still do
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      04-28-2013, 06:35 AM   #25
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Good Lord there's been huge advancement to Solar Panel Technology that is now affordable and a clear winner in the long run when it comes to sustainable living.

Your idea of sustainable living and mine are exactly the same, except for the length of the carbon cycle.
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      04-28-2013, 06:46 AM   #26
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If you actually look at the solarwatt website, some of their systems offer a charge storage solution. I don't know what they are planning on pairing with the car, but it would be a system that could charge during the day, and be able to recharge the car at night. I think most people know you cannot completely charge off solar cells, but depending on location and number of solar cells, you could get close to 80% charge from the sun. Would you complain if the government subsidized the same percentage of your gas costs?

Ideally, I would take one of the solarwatt systems with a Model S any day of the week. I just don't happen to make enough money to purchase a $100k car.

If you have been to Germany, you know that most households do haven solar panel system on their houses. If anything, it does cut down on our bill, and the German government did subsidize part of their costs. It is the short sighted, selfish train of thought that prevents many Americans from jumping onboard. Just don't think the cross section of America necessarily applies to the global market.

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      04-28-2013, 06:55 AM   #27
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Stupid iPad app won't let me edit my lack of spaces on my last post.

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      04-28-2013, 08:32 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gvega702 View Post
If you can afford it, occasionally people do something to benefit society and the planet, rather than just their pocket books.
Exactly
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      04-28-2013, 08:35 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod182 View Post
I love my electric car. I would say I am driving it twice as much as my 2011 BMW. Smooth, instant torque, no gear changes, and absolutely silent. Not to mention I have achieved up to 130mpge. Yes, the costs don't always pen out, but the concept of driving on sunlight is awesome in my opinion. I am in the planning process right now of putting up a $24,000-$30,000 solar system within the next few months. I was absolutely suprised how many Nissan Leaf customers are the same ones buying the $100,000 Tesla and $60K solar systems.

Here is an example of a modern solar installation:

https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/...tems/2Kkg31401

You can see real time production per panel. If you push the play button when looking to today's production, you can see how each panel reacts throughout the day.

An average 250 watt 3.2 ft x 5.5 ft solar panel will put out 1.2-1.3kWh daily in Southern California. My 12 miles of daily driving to/from work would be covered by just 4 panels. Pretty remarkable stuff. Soon as battery technology gets better, the electric car will become more mainstream. The LEAF battery is reported to cost $12000-$18000 to replace, and deteriorates every year. But, as it is, a Tesla S Performance sedan can fit 4 adults, and 2 kids. Has a front hood area with huge storage capacity. cg of only 17" above the ground (same as a Z06). Can run 0-60 in 4.1 second, and low 12 second qtr mile times. Won the Motor Trend Car of the year award, and absolutely stunned Road and Track. R&R stated that without the 640hp Viper (On the front cover of the 4/13 edition) clutching and revving it engine, it would lose in a 5mph-60mph race with the Tesla. And the Tesla does it with an engine the size of a small office trash can nestled between the 2 rear wheels. And it can get 88mpge, or much better efficiency than a Prius. Two of these small motors would be putting out 800+hp and around 900lbs of torque! When battery tech evolves, then we will start seeing some amazing performance numbers. Just look at the top $1M Mclaren P1 and Ferrari coming out. Both have electric motors to boost their performance. The future is going to be fascinating for electric drive technologies.

Even my LEAF has 80,000 watt motor which is quite amazing. 200lbs torque at 0rpm. A Tesla has a 320,000 watt motor (400+lbs tq at 0 rpm). Kind of amazing if you put it in 12volt terms, that would be 6666amps for the LEAF and 26,666 amps for the Tesla. The fast charger on these cars be can deliver over 50000 watts. My LEAF is loaded with heated steering wheel, heated front/rear seats, awesome back up camera, comfort access, sirius radio, home link, streaming bluetooth audio, smart phone apps, LED headlights. Very techie stuff.

I'm enjoying driving my electric car so much, my next BMW will most likely be the i3.

FYI: Here is a video I took while doing a 0-75mph run in the $100K Tesla S.




I am not quite sure where I stand on the overall alternative energy solutions spectrum yet. However, yours is the only post here that could withstand any amount of scrutiny.

A good example of making a well defined argument with substantive evidence to support your claims.

Almost everyone else pontificating on this subject here sound like your average politician (left, right, center they are pretty much all the same)
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      04-28-2013, 10:36 AM   #30
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I wonder what the payback period is for one of these $20k solar electric systems. Probably never, and that includes whatever you get from selling power back to the utilities.
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      04-28-2013, 11:54 AM   #31
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The tesla s performs quite well but i wonder how long the battery would last when driving hard the whole time eg. I can get 320 miles on one tank in the m3 but usually i get in the 190-220 range per tank.

I was at an autox once and a dude was there with the lotus looking tesla. I was thinking he left after the first run?! No he had to go charge his car and he came back. Then had to charge and come back. And again. Thats just horrible. At an hpde what would you do? Performance is not performance if it only lasts 20 minutes.

Solar based operation is meant for calculators lol.
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      04-28-2013, 06:07 PM   #32
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Solar power ON a car isn't all that practical except to maybe keep the battery charged up while parked and off. Now, there have been a bunch of long-distance solar car races, but those have the entire body covered with solar cells, bicycle wheels (typically), and weird shapes (and no internal combustion engine). This project is to provide a solar powered charging station for the vehicle. The only place on a vehicle I could see solar cells being installed is maybe on the sunroof (and some vehicles already do that). With the area involved, that might provide in the order of 50W at full sunlight...enough to maybe power the ventilation fan and radio, not move it.
I agree, solar power is more of a trendy thing for rich people to do to show off to other rich people. It costs a near fortune to pull a house off the grid, and this usually involves super high E appliances and compromises in living style. Would be very hard to get any reasonable charging out of a days worth of sunlight at those efficiencies.
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      04-29-2013, 12:40 AM   #33
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Surely you feed the power you generate into the grid during the day and the credit you get for that offsets the electricity you draw back from the grid when you charge the car. Why use battery banks at all?
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      04-29-2013, 09:07 AM   #34
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I think that bmw has proved with the I-series that environmentally friendly cars can look good. I really do like the I-series and its purpose. Well done bmw.
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      04-29-2013, 10:50 AM   #35
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      04-29-2013, 03:11 PM   #36
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man o man

billion people on this planet currently live on 2$ per day...
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      05-05-2013, 10:15 PM   #37
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billion people on this planet currently live on 2$ per day...
That's another reason we should never take more than we give.
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      08-20-2013, 09:51 AM   #38
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Solar panels on the roof of the garage are a good start - they can charge the vehicle when its there and feed power back into the property when its not - at the end of the day it may not save a fortune but it will make the car and users more energy "neutral"!
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      08-21-2013, 08:04 PM   #39
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I wonder what the payback period is for one of these $20k solar electric systems. Probably never, and that includes whatever you get from selling power back to the utilities.
Wow, I cant believe the number of negative or closed minded posters in an electric vehicle forum! I am not picking on Diver, I just quoted this post because I liked the avatar.

Solar has never been so affordable and efficient as it is today. It has nothing to do with being rich or a political statement. You can have a huge system or small and right now with tax incentives you can get about 50% of the cost back.

As far as payback goes my system will be paid back in 8 years if the electric costs don't increase. If they do it will be sooner. We have not paid an electric bill since we went live in March and we are producing excess at about 2X our usage.
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      10-22-2013, 11:50 PM   #40
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German based Solarwatt and BMW have partnered to provide a peimar solar system to be placed on home/garage roofs as part of a broader support system for the upcoming BMW i3 and i8 vehicles. The systems will be branded as 360 ELECTRIC which aim to be both aesthetically pleasing as well as functional, bringing efficient solar powered charging to your car.

Potential customers will be able to purchase the Solarwatt system at the same time as they purchase their BMWi or at a later time. The goal here is of course to create a truly sustainable backbone for owning a BMWi.

Wonderful job.. Awesome work.. Looks very expensive so it is hard for me to have similar build

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      10-23-2013, 01:05 PM   #41
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Wow, I cant believe the number of negative or closed minded posters in an electric vehicle forum! I am not picking on Diver, I just quoted this post because I liked the avatar.

Solar has never been so affordable and efficient as it is today. It has nothing to do with being rich or a political statement. You can have a huge system or small and right now with tax incentives you can get about 50% of the cost back.

As far as payback goes my system will be paid back in 8 years if the electric costs don't increase. If they do it will be sooner. We have not paid an electric bill since we went live in March and we are producing excess at about 2X our usage.
Nice going Barry. I'm on about the same payback path of about 8-10 years. Considering the system is warranted for 25 years and will probably last 30 or more, we'll be way ahead in the long run. I've been using mine to power my MINI-E and ActiveE for 3 years now and it will soon be pumping electrons into my i3. It's great to drive on sunshine!
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