[FultonMDUSA]

OK, so yesterday I was able to spend quite a bit of time using the Traffic Jam Assistant on my 23 iX50. Here are my observations. First the option to activate isn’t even offered unless:

1. I’m on an Interstate Highway. I’ve never seen it offered on state and local divided highways.
2. I have Assisted Driving already enabled. It’s not offered when in manual driving mode.
3. I’m traveling (on an Interstate Highway) under 40 mph, which isn’t normal, unless there’s an actual traffic jam!

So once I meet the above 3 conditions (and probably more conditions I haven’t listed), Traffic Jam assistance becomes available. How do I then activate it? By simply take my hands off the steering wheel! My iX steers and controls speed without my hands on the wheel. It will continue to do so until the traffic conditions allow my iX to automatically increase speed to 40 mph.

What happens at 40 mph? I get the yellow steering wheel warning telling me to put my hand on the steering wheel. So I do that, and the green steering wheel icon lights. My iX continues to steer and control speed above 40 mph! The only difference is it must detect my hand on the wheel. What if traffic slows below 40 mph again? Well, I get the Assist Plus Ready message, inviting me to take my hands off the wheel. And so it goes, back and forth, my iX warning me to put my hand on the wheel, or inviting me to take it off. Either way, my iX is fully controlling speed and steering.

So seriously, what is different between TJA and HA? Both would seem to control speed and steering below and above 40 mph. The difference is if my hands have to be on the wheel or not. Exactly what additional technology is in HA, given that they do the SAME automated driving above 40 mph?

[ggalanis]

Originally Posted by FultonMDUSA

OK, so yesterday I was able to spend quite a bit of time using the Traffic Jam Assistant on my 23 iX50. Here are my observations. First the option to activate isn’t even offered unless:

1. I’m on an Interstate Highway. I’ve never seen it offered on state and local divided highways.
2. I have Assisted Driving already enabled. It’s not offered when in manual driving mode.
3. I’m traveling (on an Interstate Highway) under 40 mph, which isn’t normal, unless there’s an actual traffic jam!

So once I meet the above 3 conditions (and probably more conditions I haven’t listed), Traffic Jam assistance becomes available. How do I then activate it? By simply take my hands off the steering wheel! My iX steers and controls speed without my hands on the wheel. It will continue to do so until the traffic conditions allow my iX to automatically increase speed to 40 mph.

What happens at 40 mph? I get the yellow steering wheel warning telling me to put my hand on the steering wheel. So I do that, and the green steering wheel icon lights. My iX continues to steer and control speed above 40 mph! The only difference is it must detect my hand on the wheel. What if traffic slows below 40 mph again? Well, I get the Assist Plus Ready message, inviting me to take my hands off the wheel. And so it goes, back and forth, my iX warning me to put my hand on the wheel, or inviting me to take it off. Either way, my iX is fully controlling speed and steering.

So seriously, what is different between TJA and HA? Both would seem to control speed and steering below and above 40 mph. The difference is if my hands have to be on the wheel or not. Exactly what additional technology is in HA, given that they do the SAME automated driving above 40 mph?

This is of course a bit of guesswork on my part based on a decade of using BMWs with various assisted driving systems.

The assisted driving does indeed to the steering for you, but there is a limit to how sharp of a turn it will do automatically for you, for whatever reason. The car normally disengages once it determines it cannot do the turn (by then you are usually out of your lane) or, what is supposed to happen, since you have your hands on the wheel and paying attention, you add in additional steering input to make the turn.

If you are in a hands free version at high speeds, the system either needs to know ahead of time that the turn is too sharp, to force you to take control ahead of time taking into consideration a normal reaction time. This likely requires higher definition mapping of the roads or better scanning of the road ahead or both in order to do it safely. Thus the possible need for better hardware to support it.

A less cautious manufacturer may just bump the 40 mph limit on the current system to 85 mph and blame the user for any issues that occur due to this, but this is not how most work.

[Boulder]

Originally Posted by FultonMDUSA

So seriously, what is different between TJA and HA? Both would seem to control speed and steering below and above 40 mph. The difference is if my hands have to be on the wheel or not. Exactly what additional technology is in HA, given that they do the SAME automated driving above 40 mph?

Active cruise control with lane keeping (what you call HA, I don't think that's the official name) operates at any speed on any road with marked lanes, but requires a hand on the wheel. If you take your hands off it will complain after a few seconds and require you to touch the wheel again.

TJA is a more advanced but also more limited version of that system. It only works on highways in traffic up to 40mph. While TJA is active you can keep your hands off the wheel forever (until the traffic jam clears and you get to over 40mph). The car will monitor that you're keeping your eyes on the road.

In my experience TJA works better than the plain active cruise control + lanekeep. It does a better job of staying centered in the lane and steering itself.

The new Highway Assistant / Motorway Assistant on the 7 series allows for hands free driving on highways even without traffic, up to 85 mph. Basically it's TJA without the "traffic" requirement and with a higher max speed. Above 85mph, or off highway, it would fall back to the basic active cruise control + lanekeep system.

From videos I've seen of the 7 series, its new system with Highway Assistant does a much better job of controlling the car. Better algorithms and sensors. Even when not operating in the handsfree Highway Assistant mode, I would guess that the basic hands-on ACC+lanekeep system in the new 7 series also performs better than the older hands-on ACC+lanekeep system in the current iX.

The iX will get the Highway Assistant upgrade soon. I'm not sure if it will be available as an OTA software update for existing iXs, or if only newly manufactured iXs will get the new system.

[VirtualGuitars]

Originally Posted by PinkNinja400Guy

Active cruise control with lane keeping (what you call HA, I don't think that's the official name) operates at any speed on any road with marked lanes, but requires a hand on the wheel. If you take your hands off it will complain after a few seconds and require you to touch the wheel again.

TJA is a more advanced, but also more limited version of that system. It only works on highways in traffic up to 40mph. While TJA is active you can keep your hands off the wheel forever (until the traffic jam clears and you get to over 40mph). The car will monitor that you're keeping your eyes on the road.

In my experience TJA works better than the plain active cruise control + lanekeep. It does a better job of staying centered in the lane and steering itself.

The new Highway Assistant / Motorway Assistant on the 7 series allows for hands free driving on highways even without traffic, up to 85 mph. Basically it's TJA without the "traffic" requirement and with a higher max speed. Above 85mph, or off highway, it would fall back to the basic active cruise control + lanekeep system.

From videos I've seen of the 7 series, its new system with Highway Assistant does a much better job of controlling the car. Better algorithms, probably also a better sensors package. Even when not operating in the handsfree Highway Assistant mode, I would guess that the basic ACC + lanekeep system on the 7 series also performs better than the older version of the system in the current iX.

The iX will get the Highway Assistant upgrade soon. I'm not sure if it will be available as an OTA [...]

You might be slightly behind here. The new ones will definitely have the option and it’s been confirmed that there will be no OTA update for existing owners at this time.

[Boulder]

Originally Posted by VirtualGuitars

You might be slightly behind here. The new ones will definitely have the option and it’s been confirmed that there will be no OTA update for existing owners at this time.

Makes sense. It's the same situation on the X5 and X7, there's a new option package which will be available for cars built after April 1st. Existing X5/X7 will not get any OTA upgrades to their systems.

[guy_incognito1420]

Yeah. If you really like the hands free stuff and want an x50, you’ll miss out on the air suspension and four wheel steering.

If you want all that, you’ve gotta jump to the M60.

If the airbag recall isn’t resolved by mid March (i.e. a remedy still isn’t available with no timeline set) I’ll have a tough decision to make.

As for now, assuming everything is buttoned up by then, I’m fine foregoing the HA. Most of the time I use semi-autonomous driving now is just in traffic. I hardly even think to use it on the highway.

That and there’s a price increase with MY24.

[NomoTesla]

I love distance control (adaptive cruise) for most situations. I do not like using the driving assistance lane-keeping feature in most situations because it adds a layer of complexity to what I am doing as a driver. I now have to monitor a computer with the competence of a 4-year-old. No thank you.

Also, I bought a BMW for the fun of the driving experience!

[VirtualGuitars]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

I love distance control (adaptive cruise) for most situations. I do not like using the driving assistance lane-keeping feature in most situations because it adds a layer of complexity to what I am doing as a driver. I now have to monitor a computer with the competence of a 4-year-old. No thank you.

Also, I bought a BMW for the fun of the driving experience!

What age rating would you give to Tesla’s FSD? 2? 3?

[NomoTesla]

Originally Posted by VirtualGuitars

What age rating would you give to Tesla’s FSD? 2? 3?

Definitely a toddler.

[FultonMDUSA]

Originally Posted by PinkNinja400Guy

In my experience TJA works better than the plain active cruise control + lanekeep. It does a better job of staying centered in the lane and steering itself.

First, thank you for your reply. Very insightful. However, this statement is counterintuitive. You're essentially saying that on mapped highways under 40mph, the iX will steer better if you take your hands off the wheel (TJA) as opposed to keeping your hands on the wheel (LKA).

[Paladin1]

I use all of the autonomous driving features, virtually all the time. It doesn't detract from manual driving and my personal driving style, and adds a layer of safety if I'm distracted or inattentive, even for fractions of a second - the leading cause of most accidents. Cameras, radar and sonic sensors are just adjuncts to human senses, not replacements.

[endi]

Originally Posted by VirtualGuitars

You might be slightly behind here. The new ones will definitely have the option and it’s been confirmed that there will be no OTA update for existing owners at this time.

And i thought BMW said the IX was level 3 ready in hardware at launch

[razor488]

Has it been determined that the 2023 isn't capable of the Highway Assistant feature or is BMW just not going to offer it OTA just because

[moesess34]

Originally Posted by razor488

Has it been determined that the 2023 isn't capable of the Highway Assistant feature or is BMW just not going to offer it OTA just because

It’s seeming like bmw won’t be upgrading us. But, there still hasn’t been a public statement about it. So, there is still hope😁

[Boulder]

Originally Posted by FultonMDUSA

First, thank you for your reply. Very insightful. However, this statement is counterintuitive. You're essentially saying that on mapped highways under 40mph, the iX will steer better if you take your hands off the wheel (TJA) as opposed to keeping your hands on the wheel (LKA).

Yes. That is what I have experienced on my X7, which has the same system as the current iX.

Originally Posted by endi

And i thought BMW said the IX was level 3 ready in hardware at launch

ACC+lanekeep (hands on) is a level 2 system.

BMW's existing TJA system and new Highway Assistant system are both "level 2+" systems. You can keep your feet off the pedals and hands off the wheel forever; there's no interaction required. But you still need to pay attention to what the car is doing. The instrument cluster has eye tracking IR cameras (you can see the IR lights dimly glowing at night on iDrive 7 BMWs, the iDrive 8 cluster might be better). The system will deactivate and fall back to level 2 lanekeeping if you aren't looking out at the road.

Mercedes is starting to launch their level 3 system. While it is active you can do things like text on your phone or work on a laptop. No need to pay attention. However, their level 3 system only works in highway traffic under 40mph in the day during good weather... so it's basically a fully autonomous version of BMW TJA, where you no longer have to pay attention to the road in front of you.

[Paladin1]

You will need to pay attention while driving on any public infrastructure that exists today, because there is no system developed - yet and in the forseeable near future - that will accommodate all of the variables that currently exist. In spite of marketing hype. Road signage and markings, other (unpredictable - and not L3) vehicles and drivers, unpredictable events like construction or road damage, weather and a thousand other inconstants will combine to make the one second that you need it - and it can't react - a potentially fatal encounter if the "driver" is absent, though physically in the car. It will/may get there, but not without billions invested on the environment in which vehicles move and exist. Absent that, there is not yet a true "L3,'" except for very limited controlled spaces that exist outside the car. Even a commercial aircraft with nothing but air around it and a very structured control system outside the craft - and a much more sophisticated automation system - requires a human pilot, and will for some time.

[VirtualGuitars]

Originally Posted by moesess34

It’s seeming like bmw won’t be upgrading us. But, there still hasn’t been a public statement about it. So, there is still hope😁

Actually, there’s not much hope. I can’t member who, but recently another forum member emailed the contact on the press release and they openly stated that there will not be an upgrade path for 2023 vehicles at this time.

[Xyz$123]

Originally Posted by VirtualGuitars

Actually, there’s not much hope. I can’t member who, but recently another forum member emailed the contact on the press release and they openly stated that there will not be an upgrade path for 2023 vehicles at this time.

I remember that post though I can’t find it now. The email reply didn’t specifically say it won’t happen. Just that the press release was only about new production.

Yes, I’m grasping at straws.

[darylp310]

We won’t know for sure for a couple more months, but using purely deductive reasoning, I would put up a lot money betting that BMW will support Highway Assistant on 2022 and 2023 iXs.

• Adaptive cruise control and Driving Assistance already works just fine up to 85 mph. But hands are needed.
  
  
• Traffic Jam assist works great up to 40 mph. But with eye tracking enabled, no hands are needed.
  
  
• From a hardware perspective, since Drivers Assistance Plus and Traffic Jam Assistant work already, the only thing needed to support Highway Assistant is new software. The i7 has the same hardware as 2023 iX’s so we know there’s no hardware limitation.
  
  
• The new software mostly consists of detailed HD maps from the HERE company. Downloading those maps to the iX should be trivial but I would assume BMW would need to pay a license fee for each car to use that data for the next 8 years.

Thus, my prediction is that they will charge a premium of $300-500 to enable this feature on older iXs.

BTW I’ve been test driving a Mustang Mach-E via Turo recently and their equivalent of Highway Assist, BlueCruise, works just fine. (They use something similar to HD maps to pre-define the road details). The Mach-E is a much less expensive car and has less technological potential than the iX, so I’d be totally shocked if old IXs couldn’t match this capability.

Who wants to put up some money? Haha! Payable on May 1st if there’s no announcement of an upgrade by then? (I’m irrationally confident in this!

[hugo_nz]

Originally Posted by darylp310

We won’t know for sure for a couple more months, but using purely deductive reasoning, I would put up a lot money betting that BMW will support Highway Assistant on 2022 and 2023 iXs.

• Adaptive cruise control and Driving Assistance already works just fine up to 85 mph. But hands are needed.
  
  
• Traffic Jam assist works great up to 40 mph. But with eye tracking enabled, no hands are needed.
  
  
• From a hardware perspective, since Drivers Assistance Plus and Traffic Jam Assistant work already, the only thing needed to support Highway Assistant is new software. The i7 has the same hardware as 2023 iX’s so we know there’s no hardware limitation.
  
  
• The new software mostly consists of detailed HD maps from the HERE company. Downloading those maps to the iX should be trivial but I would assume BMW would need to pay a license fee for each car to use that data for the next 8 years.

Thus, my prediction is that they will charge a premium of $300-500 to enable this feature on older iXs.

BTW I’ve been test driving a Mustang Mach-E via Turo recently and their equivalent of Highway Assist, BlueCruise, works just fine. (They use something similar to HD maps to pre-define the road details). The Mach-E is a much less expensive car and has less technological potential than the iX, so I’d be totally shocked if old IXs couldn’t match this capability.

Who wants to put up some money? Haha! Payable on May 1st if there’s no announcement of an upgrade by then? (I’m irrationally confident in this!

Likely on the MY24 but unlikely on prior years. MGU4 may simply not be sufficiently powerful to process the Here-HD maps.

[Xyz$123]

Originally Posted by darylp310

We won’t know for sure for a couple more months, but using purely deductive reasoning, I would put up a lot money betting that BMW will support Highway Assistant on 2022 and 2023 iXs.


Adaptive cruise control and Driving Assistance already works just fine up to 85 mph. But hands are needed.


Traffic Jam assist works great up to 40 mph. But with eye tracking enabled, no hands are needed.


From a hardware perspective, since Drivers Assistance Plus and Traffic Jam Assistant work already, the only thing needed to support Highway Assistant is new software. The i7 has the same hardware as 2023 iX’s so we know there’s no hardware limitation.


The new software mostly consists of detailed HD maps from the HERE company. Downloading those maps to the iX should be trivial but I would assume BMW would need to pay a license fee for each car to use that data for the next 8 years.


Thus, my prediction is that they will charge a premium of $300-500 to enable this feature on older iXs.

BTW I’ve been test driving a Mustang Mach-E via Turo recently and their equivalent of Highway Assist, BlueCruise, works just fine. (They use something similar to HD maps to pre-define the road details). The Mach-E is a much less expensive car and has less technological potential than the iX, so I’d be totally shocked if old IXs couldn’t match this capability.

Who wants to put up some money? Haha! Payable on May 1st if there’s no announcement of an upgrade by then? (I’m irrationally confident in this!

All makes sense to me. Hope BMW agrees. I would add, how could any for profit company pass up a revenue stream like that. Bluecruise on my Mach-E is $600 for three years after one year free.

[Electric Sloth]

Originally Posted by darylp310

The i7 has the same hardware as 2023 iX’s so we know there’s no hardware limitation.

The i7 has MGU5, which based on reports from hugo_nz the iX will get for builds from March, so 2024 models. If the new software requires MGU5, 2022-2023 iX won’t get it.