Questions you thought were too dumb to ask

exxxviii · 02-20-2025, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerkler

I've just discovered something 'interesting'. I normally drive in the personal driving mode and today when I was cruising at 30mph on a pretty level street the car was showing 1.9 miles/kWh, however when I switched to efficiency mode this suddenly jumped to 2.9. I tried this numerous times and efficiency mode consistently gave me 1-2.5 miles/kWh more.

Now I would expect efficiency to give me more range overall as you're not accelerating as hard etc, however what I didn't expect was that it would improve efficiency when you're on a constant throttle at a constant speed, and I can't work out why that would be. In my mind if you're at a constant speed on a constant throttle it shouldn't matter what mode you're in as you're using the same amount of power

I know efficiency puts climate into an efficient mode, and turns off seat massage (which I don't use anyway) but I wouldn't have expected it to make such a difference. Air cons was off, seat and steering wheel heating was off, and temp was only set to 17°C.

Anyway, I found it interesting

A few months ago I was doing my routine drives and switching between Efficiency and Personal to compare the impacts. Efficiency was better, but only by around 0.1 - 0.2 miles/kWh. (Efficiency has an option to go full hog on HVAC restrictions - I do not select that.)

My routine drive this morning at -3° C was 2.3 miles/kWh. Yesterday the same drive at around 4° C was 2.8 miles/kWh. This drive is usually between 2.7 and 2.9 in winter, so today's may have had different traffic flows in addition to lower temperature. All was in Personal mode.

NomoTesla · 02-20-2025, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrettKA7

I worked at Tesla for 8 years and worked directly with many battery engineers. Obviously, BMW isn’t using the exact same tech as Tesla but I have to imagine some of it translates.

They always told me the absolute best thing you could possibly do for battery health is to do 60-40-60-40-60% cycles for daily driving, but it’s also the absolute worst thing you can do for battery calibration. When you keep it in the 40-70% range all the time, you’ll frequently find yourself parking the car at 190 miles of range and when you come back, it’s at 175 miles of range despite losing no actual charge.

I spend most of the year in the 30-50% range, with occasional road trips where I use the battery's full range. I don't see my range drifting down at this limited SOC range like it did with my Tesla, which was 9 years old when I sold it. However, I assumed Tesla had made some advances in that regard.

In my Tesla group, the advice continues to be given to occasionally take the battery down to 10% and charge back to 100% to keep things well calibrated. I think doing that just because is not the best advice, but fine if doing it as part of a road trip or something like that. If one charges 10%-100% regularly just to keep the battery calibrated, noticeable degradation may eventually become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

ggalanis · 02-20-2025, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

I spend most of the year in the 30-50% range, with occasional road trips where I use the battery's full range. I don't see my range drifting down at this limited SOC range like it did with my Tesla, which was 9 years old when I sold it. However, I assumed Tesla had made some advances in that regard.

In my Tesla group, the advice continues to be given to occasionally take the battery down to 10% and charge back to 100% to keep things well calibrated. I think doing that just because is not the best advice, but fine if doing it as part of a road trip or something like that. If one charges 10%-100% regularly just to keep the battery calibrated, noticeable degradation may eventually become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

that effect depends on the chemistry used in the battery, and is a problem particularly with LFP packs. It is because their Voltage vs SoC curve is very flat. Couple that with the reality that the BMS in every pack "guesses" SoC based on a few things, one being the voltage, it makes it hard for the BMS to accurately determine the SoC if the current voltage can apply for a broad range of SoC. This is why Tesla instructs ppl to regularly full charge a LFP battery to help the BMS recalibrate.

NomoTesla · 02-20-2025, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggalanis

that effect depends on the chemistry used in the battery, and is a problem particularly with LFP packs. It is because their Voltage vs SoC curve is very flat. Couple that with the reality that the BMS in every pack "guesses" SoC based on a few things, one being the voltage, it makes it hard for the BMS to accurately determine the SoC if the current voltage can apply for a broad range of SoC. This is why Tesla instructs ppl to regularly full charge a LFP battery to help the BMS recalibrate.

Tesla's advice to regularly fully charge the battery to help the BMS recalibrate has been given for years to owners even before the advent of LFP. The (bad) advice being given to owners of LFP batteries is to keep the cars charged to 100% all the time. There is a huge misunderstanding out there about that.

ggalanis · 02-20-2025, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

Tesla's advice to regularly fully charge the battery to help the BMS recalibrate has been given for years to owners even before the advent of LFP. The (bad) advice being given to owners of LFP batteries is to keep the cars charged to 100% all the time. There is a huge misunderstanding out there about that.

people assumed that because the company suggested charging to 100% regularly, that it meant that LFP batteries have no issue being at 100% and as you pointed out, that was simply not true.

snerkler · 02-20-2025, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggalanis

what was the outside temp?

12°C, although I'm not sure what difference that would make as I was swapping between modes during the same journey so therefore the same outside temp?

ggalanis · 02-20-2025, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerkler

12°C, although I'm not sure what difference that would make as I was swapping between modes during the same journey so therefore the same outside temp?

the difference would have been that if it was super cold out, the difference between normal HVAC operation and the stingy efficient one could explain the big difference.

At 12C with the climate at 17C, it doesn't explain that big of a difference IMHO.

snerkler · 02-20-2025, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggalanis

the difference would have been that if it was super cold out, the difference between normal HVAC operation and the stingy efficient one could explain the big difference.

At 12C with the climate at 17C, it doesn't explain that big of a difference IMHO.

Ahh right, not sure then

javapro · 02-20-2025, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerkler

I've just discovered something 'interesting'. I normally drive in the personal driving mode and today when I was cruising at 30mph on a pretty level street the car was showing 1.9 miles/kWh, however when I switched to efficiency mode this suddenly jumped to 2.9. I tried this numerous times and efficiency mode consistently gave me 1-2.5 miles/kWh more.

Now I would expect efficiency to give me more range overall as you're not accelerating as hard etc, however what I didn't expect was that it would improve efficiency when you're on a constant throttle at a constant speed, and I can't work out why that would be. In my mind if you're at a constant speed on a constant throttle it shouldn't matter what mode you're in as you're using the same amount of power

I know efficiency puts climate into an efficient mode, and turns off seat massage (which I don't use anyway) but I wouldn't have expected it to make such a difference. Air cons was off, seat and steering wheel heating was off, and temp was only set to 17°C.

Anyway, I found it interesting

Just the A/C being off won't make much difference. Heat is what consumes a lot of kWs.

snerkler · 02-22-2025, 04:15 PM

Is there a way to have different iconic sounds in efficiency mode? Some say there’s a very subtle sound but I can’t hear it and would prefer it to sound like it does in personal or sport mode.

I can’t find a way to pick and choose what sound I want which is a strange decision by BMW (imo) if you can’t.

Paladin1 · 02-22-2025, 04:20 PM

AFAIK Efficient Mode turns off Iconic Sounds - for, well, efficiency...

LVBMW · 02-22-2025, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerkler

Is there a way to have different iconic sounds in efficiency mode? Some say there’s a very subtle sound but I can’t hear it and would prefer it to sound like it does in personal or sport mode.

I can’t find a way to pick and choose what sound I want which is a strange decision by BMW (imo) if you can’t.

I feel like there is a very subtle sound in efficient mode or I might be hearing things. You cannot customize the iconic sounds or pick and choose which sound you want in which mode.

Paladin1 · 02-22-2025, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LVBMW

I feel like there is a very subtle sound in efficient mode or I might be hearing things. You cannot customize the iconic sounds or pick and choose which sound you want in which mode.

Although widely reported in professional and non-professional multiple reviews and on this and other forums (fora?), over several years, that Efficient Mode turned off Iconic Sounds, when in doubt:

This is what shows up in my iX 50 when in Efficient Mode in the DRIVETRAIN AND CHASSIS settings, and Iconic Sounds are clearly on. How MUCH they are on may be purely subjective, since I hear nothing, but maybe it depends on your hearing, or perhaps other settings. The most accurate statement is perhaps that the setting for Iconic Sounds is not off in Efficient Mode, although the sound may - or may not be ("The drive sound is adjusted depending on the My Modes").

snerkler · 02-23-2025, 03:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LVBMW

I feel like there is a very subtle sound in efficient mode or I might be hearing things. You cannot customize the iconic sounds or pick and choose which sound you want in which mode.

Shame BMW put so much restriction on customising things, I never understand why software developers do this, if you have the features why not let the user decide what they want

snerkler · 02-23-2025, 03:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paladin1

Although widely reported in professional and non-professional multiple reviews and on this and other forums (fora?), over several years, that Efficient Mode turned off Iconic Sounds, when in doubt:

This is what shows up in my iX 50 when in Efficient Mode in the DRIVETRAIN AND CHASSIS settings, and Iconic Sounds are clearly on. How MUCH they are on may be purely subjective, since I hear nothing, but maybe it depends on your hearing, or perhaps other settings. The most accurate statement is perhaps that the setting for Iconic Sounds is not off in Efficient Mode, although the sound may - or may not be ("The drive sound is adjusted depending on the My Modes").

That's kind of why I asked, because when I check this on my car the iconic sounds are showing as active as per your photo

LeeInCT · 03-02-2025, 01:37 PM

gesture controls... I can get all of the othe ones to work, but not the answer call (index finger pointing) and rejecting a pop up (hand sweeping) to work

any tips on how to get these two to work?
thanks!

snerkler · 03-03-2025, 06:23 AM

What is considered a good ambient operating temperature to get optimal (or close to optimal) range?

The reason that I ask is that I've done my first motorway trip in my M60 today, sticking to the speed limit (70mph UK) with several miles at 50mph due to roadworks and I've only returned 2.6 miles/kWh and I've seen that other members/users are getting over 3 miles/kWh.

The ambient temp is much higher today, ranging between 10-12°C (50-54°F) so I was hoping to see more range.

The only other thing I've thought is that the M1 from Junction 29-41 is quite hilly which is not going to help the range

ggalanis · 03-03-2025, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerkler

What is considered a good ambient operating temperature to get optimal (or close to optimal) range?

Above 20C.

snerkler · 03-03-2025, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggalanis

Above 20C.

Thanks, so living in the UK I'll never get optimal range

TulipTheBeaver · 03-12-2025, 03:41 PM

Hi, where are the controls to operate the tailgate from the driver's seat?

[DT] · 03-12-2025, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TulipTheBeaver

Hi, where are the controls to operate the tailgate from the driver's seat?

There's a rocker switch down low, in front of the side pocket storage ...

snerkler · 03-12-2025, 04:14 PM

I don’t find that my seats, and especially the steering wheel don’t get as hot as previous cars I’ve had (I don’t think it helps having the thicker M steering wheel).They’re warm alright, but on my old Land Rover the steering wheel got so warm I’d have to turn it down after a while.

I assume if I have the steering wheel/seat heating set to 3 on the manual controls that’s the hottest they’ll get and they’re not affected by the individual settings in the climate settings menu for the steering wheel heating and seat heating when in auto where you can set it to off, medium, high, very high?

If I set these to auto at what temperature do they activate? I’ve looked in the manual but I can’t find the answer.

02-22-2025, 04:15 PM	#164
snerkler First Lieutenant 105 Rep 306 Posts Drives: F15 X5 x30d M Sport Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Chesterfield, UK iTrader: (0)	Is there a way to have different iconic sounds in efficiency mode? Some say there’s a very subtle sound but I can’t hear it and would prefer it to sound like it does in personal or sport mode. I can’t find a way to pick and choose what sound I want which is a strange decision by BMW (imo) if you can’t.
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02-22-2025, 04:20 PM	#165
Paladin1 Brigadier General 6658 Rep 4,972 Posts Drives: 2022 iX xDrive50, DGM Join Date: Jun 2019 Location: Midwest iTrader: (0) Garage List 2023 iX xDrive M60 [0.00] 2022 iX xDrive50 [9.00]	AFAIK Efficient Mode turns off Iconic Sounds - for, well, efficiency...
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03-02-2025, 01:37 PM	#170
LeeInCT Second Lieutenant 148 Rep 216 Posts Drives: F87 m2, iX D50 Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: CT iTrader: (0)	gesture controls... I can get all of the othe ones to work, but not the answer call (index finger pointing) and rejecting a pop up (hand sweeping) to work any tips on how to get these two to work? thanks!
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03-03-2025, 06:23 AM	#171
snerkler First Lieutenant 105 Rep 306 Posts Drives: F15 X5 x30d M Sport Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Chesterfield, UK iTrader: (0)	What is considered a good ambient operating temperature to get optimal (or close to optimal) range? The reason that I ask is that I've done my first motorway trip in my M60 today, sticking to the speed limit (70mph UK) with several miles at 50mph due to roadworks and I've only returned 2.6 miles/kWh and I've seen that other members/users are getting over 3 miles/kWh. The ambient temp is much higher today, ranging between 10-12°C (50-54°F) so I was hoping to see more range. The only other thing I've thought is that the M1 from Junction 29-41 is quite hilly which is not going to help the range
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03-12-2025, 03:41 PM	#174
TulipTheBeaver Registered 0 Rep 3 Posts Drives: 2023 xDrive50 Join Date: Mar 2025 Location: USA, Indiana iTrader: (0)	Tailgate Controls Hi, where are the controls to operate the tailgate from the driver's seat?
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03-12-2025, 04:14 PM	#176
snerkler First Lieutenant 105 Rep 306 Posts Drives: F15 X5 x30d M Sport Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Chesterfield, UK iTrader: (0)	I don’t find that my seats, and especially the steering wheel don’t get as hot as previous cars I’ve had (I don’t think it helps having the thicker M steering wheel).They’re warm alright, but on my old Land Rover the steering wheel got so warm I’d have to turn it down after a while. I assume if I have the steering wheel/seat heating set to 3 on the manual controls that’s the hottest they’ll get and they’re not affected by the individual settings in the climate settings menu for the steering wheel heating and seat heating when in auto where you can set it to off, medium, high, very high? If I set these to auto at what temperature do they activate? I’ve looked in the manual but I can’t find the answer.
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