[iCARMIX]

Originally Posted by Bee Pee

any concerns about using oem calipers designed for steel brakes being used for CCB ? I’m under the impression CCB are capable of generating much more heat that steel brakes. How do oem calipers cope with higher heat stress / cycles ???

From my experience, regular M Series brake calipers and CCB brake calipers are essentially the same in both design and materials, with only minor dimensional differences.

As for temps, carbon ceramic brake discs don't actually generate higher temperatures than cast iron discs. Instead, carbon ceramic discs are more effective at resisting high temperatures than cast iron discs, with remarkable heat tolerance properties. Frankly speaking, they're less prone to deformation or failure, making them more suitable for...aggressive driving, for example.

[Bee Pee]

Originally Posted by iCARMIX

From my experience, regular M Series brake calipers and CCB brake calipers are essentially the same in both design and materials, with only minor dimensional differences.

As for temps, carbon ceramic brake discs don't actually generate higher temperatures than cast iron discs. Instead, carbon ceramic discs are more effective at resisting high temperatures than cast iron discs, with remarkable heat tolerance properties. Frankly speaking, they're less prone to deformation or failure, making them more suitable for...aggressive driving, for example.

F10 and F8x gold calipers for 400mm CCB came with high temp Ti pistons and higher temp seals compared to 395mm iron disc/rotor std blue caliper from factory.

Your point above reinforces why gold calipers had these upgrades. Unlike iron disc/rotor, CCB does not act as a heat-sink; higher heat generated by CCB must be dissipated elsewhere ie into caliper themselves.

[exxxviii]

Originally Posted by iCARMIX

As for temps, carbon ceramic brake discs don't actually generate higher temperatures than cast iron discs. Instead, carbon ceramic discs are more effective at resisting high temperatures than cast iron discs, with remarkable heat tolerance properties.

Originally Posted by Bee Pee

Unlike iron disc/rotor, CCB does not act as a heat-sink; higher heat generated by CCB must be dissipated elsewhere ie into caliper themselves.

Quick nerdy thoughts about conservation of energy and thermodynamics...

Brakes convert kinetic energy into thermal energy (heat). For a given stop, any kind of brake system will create the exact same amount of heat - the brake materials are irrelevant.

So, the critical questions are - "what does the heat do to the brake components, and what do the brakes do with the heat?" They need to convect the heat away as rapidly as possible while also surviving the heat that is not immediately convected away. Ceramics have the convenient property of handling heat extraordinarily well, until it can be dissipated.

[LVBMW]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

For those of us in the USA, yes. Anytime a call comes through from WhatsApp (or someone gives a WhatsApp number) it's a 100% total scam. Or a relative calling from a 3rd world country (Italy is included).



Thank goodness your woke-centric-everyone-is-a-racist attitude doesn't dictate the rules of this forum. I think you should be reprimanded or banned for saying someone else should be reprimanded or banned. Maybe, just maybe, you should stop co-opting the struggles of others to make yourself feel better.

I communicate with my dog sitter all the time through WhatsApp. Pretty sure she’s never scammed me and never will…

Just saying even though

[NORAGRETS]

While the brakes are sick, don’t get me wrong, what a massive waste of money on a car that’s never going to see speed or conditions in which carbon ceramic brakes make ANY sense…keep the OEM brakes and just put some grippier pads in them. Problem solved. Saved you about $17,800 too. Oh, plus you don’t have to worry about chipped or cracked rotors that cost $4000 each to replace.

[NomoTesla]

Originally Posted by NORAGRETS

While the brakes are sick, don’t get me wrong, what a massive waste of money on a car that’s never going to see speed or conditions in which carbon ceramic brakes make ANY sense…keep the OEM brakes and just put some grippier pads in them. Problem solved. Saved you about $17,800 too. Oh, plus you don’t have to worry about chipped or cracked rotors that cost $4000 each to replace.

I say the same thing about folks who lower their SUVs as if they were sports cars. Isn't added ground clearance one of the main reasons why one purchased an SUV? Lowering it to the ground isn't going to have any significant impact on driving dynamics in a SUV while causing nothing but problems in terms of having the suspension altered by a third party and also putting onesself at risk of bottoming out all the time.

Seems like there is a segment of vehicle owners who are gluttons for punishment and with a hole burning in their wallets.

[SterlingE30]

Originally Posted by exxxviii

Brakes convert kinetic energy into thermal energy (heat). For a given stop, any kind of brake system will create the exact same amount of heat - the brake materials are irrelevant.

True if you’re simply comparing carbon ceramics and steel rotors over a single brake application. At that point the tire will probably dictate braking performance more than the brakes themselves. The entire benefit behind CC rotors is lack of fade at high temps during constant heavy braking (i.e. a race) in which case the hardware in the brake caliper would absolutely need to be designed specifically for those higher temps. Of course nobody is putting their IX through those paces so in this application it’s pretty irrelevant but if it were me I’d prefer to leave the single most important system in whole car to more reputable and established brands.

[exxxviii]

Originally Posted by SterlingE30

True if you’re simply comparing carbon ceramics and steel rotors over a single brake application. At that point the tire will probably dictate braking performance more than the brakes themselves. The entire benefit behind CC rotors is lack of fade at high temps during constant heavy braking (i.e. a race) in which case the hardware in the brake caliper would absolutely need to be designed specifically for those higher temps. Of course nobody is putting their IX through those paces so in this application it’s pretty irrelevant but if it were me I’d prefer to leave the single most important system in whole car to more reputable and established brands.

Dang, grab a statement out of context much and go down a rabbit hole???

Did you read the entire post. That statement you quoted was about thermodynamics, and it had no commentary on types of brake materials. The sentences that followed explored the thermodynamics question.

We are in total agreement about the value of carbon ceramic brakes. But what you wrote had nothing to do with what I wrote.

[SterlingE30]

Originally Posted by exxxviii

Dang, grab a statement out of context much and go down a rabbit hole???

What else would I be doing at 1 in the morning

I misunderstood your statement, I initially thought you were implying the only important factor is rotor material but now realize you were simply talking about the physics of why ceramics are so useful.

[ubercruise]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

I say the same thing about folks who lower their SUVs as if they were sports cars. Isn't added ground clearance one of the main reasons why one purchased an SUV? Lowering it to the ground isn't going to have any significant impact on driving dynamics in a SUV while causing nothing but problems in terms of having the suspension altered by a third party and also putting onesself at risk of bottoming out all the time.

Seems like there is a segment of vehicle owners who are gluttons for punishment and with a hole burning in their wallets.

I don't ever do this, but as someone who wants a wagon I can get it from that aspect since we have hardly any wagons to choose from here in the US. Of course it's not the same, the body shape needs to make sense (otherwise you're just making a large hatchback) and I also don't mean slam the car to the floor.

But I'm too cheap and lazy to do this, and I probably do get more use out of the ride height anyway, not to mention I'd rather not mess with the driving dynamics.