TV News Reporter and Cameraman Killed During LIVE Broadcast!

[Mr Tonka]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Perversely i think you do. The gun culture is so ingrained that the guys doing the mass shootings are well trained, quite good shots, on most occasions anyway.

Certainly the Columbine and Sandy Hook killers seemed to be able to pick people off.

In saying that, you misunderstood the post from Nick, there's just less guns in circulation.

With my experience at gun ranges, from experience, this general statement is false. Our police who have to qualify aren't exactly accurate.

However the Columbine killers were different. They actually went into the woods to practice and thus became mildly proficient with their weapons.

The sandy hook killer just had many, innocent, non-combative, children in a very confined area.

Again, just my range experience, but even many ex-military people aren't very proficient with guns. Neither of my nephews, one in the marines, one the army could hit the broad side of a barn with a hand gun. A rifle is a different story, but most military personnel never even shoot a hand gun during their service.

[PINeely]

Originally Posted by Nick the Greek

Don't fully agree. The UKs gun crime tends to be gang related, and often ends in murder.

Kinda proves the point that only criminals will get a hold of guns when you ban them.

BRB guys, I'm off to lunch.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by PINeely

What kind of rate? Rate of violence versus population? Rate of change, rate of increase, rate of decline? Alfisti was not specific.

It was clear to all of us except you...
So maybe it's better you don't go there

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by PINeely

By firearm yes, but by other means no. Same for the US too, I think most homicides here are perpetrated by a blunt object.

Wrong on every account.

Homicide rate is 1.0 for UK, 4.7 for US.

Method of homicide in the states is nearly 70% with a gun. In the UK it is closer to 7%, combine this with the broader homicide rate and the pro gun argument falls to pieces from a math perspective. The violence in the UK is there but the death rate is lower, the only difference is the availability of firearms.

[C5driver]

We live in a world with risk and trying to childproof life is impossible. People will die unnecessarily, whether by accident or by evil doers. It's a fact of life.

RIP

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Mr Tonka

With my experience at gun ranges, from experience, this general statement is false. Our police who have to qualify aren't exactly accurate.

However the Columbine killers were different. They actually went into the woods to practice and thus became mildly proficient with their weapons.

The sandy hook killer just had many, innocent, non-combative, children in a very confined area.

Again, just my range experience, but even many ex-military people aren't very proficient with guns. Neither of my nephews, one in the marines, one the army could hit the broad side of a barn with a hand gun. A rifle is a different story, but most military personnel never even shoot a hand gun during their service.

Sandy Hook kid had a background with guns, mummy bought them for him, was well versed in operation etc.

This gets back to the bigger picture, you immerse people with guns and they know how to use them, the avg citizen in other developed countries wouldn't know how to release the safety.

[Mr Tonka]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Not in my experience. The US hangs pretty hard right, Canadians sit centre/centre left. I'd say Australia is Canada's closest relative if you ignore sports.

Big country
Small population
Mostly useless ice or sand
Commonwealth history
High tax rates
High social security
Broad based health coverage
Tight gun laws

There's a lot in common.

Agree. If Canada wasn't cold, and had similar gun laws, i'd probably move there. Aside from sports related violence, Canadians seem to be pretty laid back.

[Alfisti]

Most Americans say that until they see the tax rates.

[Mr Tonka]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Sandy Hook kid had a background with guns, mummy bought them for him, was well versed in operation etc.

This gets back to the bigger picture, you immerse people with guns and they know how to use them, the avg citizen in other developed countries wouldn't know how to release the safety.

That may be true, but an untrained monkey could have created as much devastation as the Sandy Hook bastard. Trained or untrained, anyone can be effective when shooting fish in a barrel.

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Sandy Hook kid had a background with guns, mummy bought them for him, was well versed in operation etc.

This gets back to the bigger picture, you immerse people with guns and they know how to use them, the avg citizen in other developed countries wouldn't know how to release the safety.

I thought the guns belonged to his mother?

I do remember he reloaded constantly without really needing to, only using a fraction of bullets in the mag before dumping it for a new one.

[Shredicus]

The liveleak video from the shooter's gopro is pretty gnarly

[Sara504]

Originally Posted by Shredicus

The liveleak video from the shooter's gopro is pretty gnarly

Explain what you mean by "gnarly."

[Mr Tonka]

Originally Posted by Sara504

Explain what you mean by "gnarly."

Gnarly - Disgusting and deplorable. Possibly worthy of public execution.

[NoSHAM3]

Originally Posted by Sara504

Explain what you mean by "gnarly."

I hope he means sickening, depressing, atrocious, etc...

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Most Americans say that until they see the tax rates.

Doesn't stop Americans from living in Chicago or California...

Hell, one place doesn't even have water...

[TXSTYLE]

Former LEO here.
Current CCL here.
I understand the Constitution and many other laws of the land VERY well.

Gun Laws and Ease of Access to Firearms in the U.S. needs to be seriously addressed... Period.

I have very close friends who are local swat. We hang out, work out etc. They are adamant that guns are far too plentiful and always manage to get in the hands of the wrong people. I agree. What is the solution? THAT is the very difficult BUT certainly needs to be addressed BIGTIME question.

[fecurtis]

In slang terms "gnarly" could also mean extreme.

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by TXSTYLE

Former LEO here.
Current CCL here.
I understand the Constitution and many other laws of the land VERY well.

Gun Laws and Ease of Access to Firearms in the U.S. needs to be seriously addressed... Period.

I have very close friends who are local swat. We hang out, work out etc. They are adamant that guns are far too plentiful and always manage to get in the hands of the wrong people. I agree. What is the solution? THAT is the very difficult BUT certainly needs to be addressed BIGTIME question.

I bet they would think that, they're the ones who put their asses on the line whenever shit like this happens.

[TXSTYLE]

If you can't, won't or refuse to even acknowledge that much, you are oblivious.

[Sara504]

Originally Posted by Mr Tonka

Gnarly - Disgusting and deplorable. Possibly worthy of public execution.

Originally Posted by NoSHAM3

I hope he means sickening, depressing, atrocious, etc...

I hope so too.....however it also can be used as "cool" or "awesome." People are sick.

[ASBSECU E93]

Read many of these posts and stats...IMO...If a person is willing to sacrifice their life to take another - regardless of the choice of weapon, then it is almost impossible to stop the act...

In this instance, it was perpetrated by a lone gunman on completely unsuspecting victims...but the fact remains that a random act of violence can happen anywhere, and with any weapon...not just a gun. The gunman had no prior background history that would legally prohibit acquiring a firearm either.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by fecurtis

Doesn't stop Americans from living in Chicago or California...

Hell, one place doesn't even have water...

There's no comparing the net tax rate of California or Chicago with that of Canada. It's not even close.