[FStop7]

Originally Posted by anmcguire

If it isn't about fear, then why carry one? Aggression? I can understand using a firearm for sport, but this thread really isn't about that.

Do you carry a spare tire in your car out of fear or aggression?

[radix]

Originally Posted by FStop7

Do you carry a spare tire in your car out of fear or aggression?

Fear.

[scollins]

Originally Posted by damadama

lets the carjacker take your car if he has a gun on you. thats why you have insurance. Chances are he won't think twice about filling your back seat with brains if you try something funny.

If I aint gots no guns who gonna be protect me and my family?! cough don't be ignorant, you arent the criminal ... you are the yuppy bitch in the bmw thats about to get pistol whipped and/or shot. Your mindset is why we have so many fuckin retards such as yourself carrying around guns thinking they are somehow helping the problem.

We've mostly managed to keep this thread clear of personal attacks. Typically when someone is in an argument they feel they are losing, they escalate their arguments to include personal attacks and ridicule. That actually weakens your position.....

But anyway.....

Carjacking is about SPEED. And by speed, I mean how fast can the criminal get you out of the car, get in and drive off. Do you think that thug is going to give me the chance to get in the back to unbuckle my kids from their car seats before he wants to drive off? HELL NO!

And if the criminal is willing to committ an armed robbery, I don't think they are going to think twice about it being "kidnapping" either.

When I'm out driving, I'm driving in a very big "weapon." 4,000 lbs of car is a pretty damn effective weapon when it has to be. In a carjacking scenario, you have to evaluate all the options.
Can you drive off?
Can you back out?
Can you run the guy over?
If the answer to those questions is no, what are your remaining options? Just give up the car? Yes, as long as there is nobody else in the car that can't get themselves out in a hurry (i.e. kids.)
If you are armed, you've added one more option.

I like having lots and lots of options.

[Ferg]

What the hell kind of neighborhood do you live in. I think it's time to move.

[Glacked]

cuz of ppl like you who need to carry weapons

Be careful lumping everyone into that category. With the amount of weapons on the roadway at any given time - I'd say 1 out of every 5 people I stop have a weapon in the vehicle - and the amount of road rage incidents, you're talking about a vast minority of people who chose to act like this - aka the criminal element. About once every six months or so we get a call about some idiot showing his handgun to another driver on the interstate. Usually involves some minor traffic violation turned "worst thing ever" in the mind of the idiot. If they break a law, they go to jail - again, criminal element. Just last week there were two seperate incidents where a CCW weapon was used for defense (neither fired) that ended with us catching the BGs and the victim being alive because of it (based off what happened, what the BGs said they were there to do and prior experience walking through blood, brains, hair and the like on similar calls). Didn't read that in the news, did you? If it bleeds, it leads. They rarely print the stories that end in the good guy's favor - unless it bleeds.

And the most recent road rage incidents I can find on the Austin TX news does not mention a third party death. Link please to the story please?

nothing in this world is worth dying 4

I'm sure you mean it. I do not feel the same way.

[aggie57]

Originally Posted by scollins

That is the most unbelievably idiotic thought process I've ever heard. So clearly I must be a criminal intent on committing mass murder because I carry a sidearm and knives? Never mind that I've never been convicted of crime of any kind, and have passed numerous federal and state backgrounds on a regular basis?

And I know quite a few Australians, and I've never heard one of them utter such nonsense. They are all in the military though, so maybe that is the difference. They are "sheep dogs" and not "sheep." You are clearly one of the "sheep."



So you use a knife to carve a ham? How about using a firearm to shoot the pig, so that you can have your Christmas ham? So now the firearm is a tool, used to put food on the table. You can use a firearm for target shooting. It is even an Olympic SPORT. Try to control your breathing and heart rate to such levels that you can put a shot into 3mm at 50m (using the metric system for you.) I've just given you two examples of firearms not being used soley as "weapons." They are multi-purpose tools, and not simply just "weapons."



Uh, what? Are you saying that since some people will always operate outside the law, one way to indentify them is to see if they are carrying weapons? So carrying a weapon is a defacto indicator of the willingness to commit crimes? Wow, just wow.

Actually I grew up in a military family. My father served for 22 years, fought in Malaysia and flew in and out of Vietnam supporting our forces there on several occasions. Funnily enough I also worked in what we call an Abbatoir in my school days so I know perfectly well how meat arrives at the table.

The comments relate solely to guns in general society and how they are viewed over here. Sporting and hunting use is accepted and supported.

So yes, if you carried guns and knives here as you do in the US you would be regarded as having criminal intent. That's how it's treated and that's the point. I'm not asking you to agree.

[achenator]

Originally Posted by damadama

And when you look up to the barrel of a gun in your face you evaluate how many of those options? Give it up, nothing in this world is worth dying 4.

step 1: oops i just shit my pants

step 2: consider whether to pull out gun, ok lets do it

step 3: carjacker pulls away with your brain covered child in the back seat.


Saw on the news last night 2 idiots got into a road-rage fight. 1 Pulls a knife the other pulls a gun, a shot gets fired, but instead of 1 of these 2 halfwits getting shot it was some random lady that was out shopping with her daughter. Shot in the face & killed, randomly cuz of ppl like you who need to carry weapons.

Here in New Orleans it's not about carjacking. Here's what's gonna happen. They carjack you but not for your car. First they make you drive them to the ATM and take out some cash. Then they take you to one of the thousands of abandoned flooded out houses in the 9th ward and shoot you in the head. Then they might take your car. They don't want your car. There are some cold blooded mother fuckers in this area. I'll put the N.O. thugs up against any others. Houston is begging us to take them back. So you can judge all you want in Austin, Texas but here they shoot for fun.

[Mk23]

Originally Posted by FStop7

Do you carry a spare tire in your car out of fear or aggression?

Perfect reply...

A lot of people around my neighborhood have plywood in their garage in case of a hurricane, I could bet that none of them will answer they have it out of fear...

[Tondtar]

Hmmmm ....I thought you can carry a gun only if you ride a horse and wear chaps and boots

[jaiman]

Originally Posted by scollins

No need to feel bad for me. I actually feel bad for you, since you have far fewer rights living in Canada.

Can you list all of these rights Canadians don't have?

[radix]

Originally Posted by Mk335i

Perfect reply...

A lot of people around my neighborhood have plywood in their garage in case of a hurricane, I could bet that none of them will answer they have it out of fear...

Actually they probably would, out of fear of their property being damaged. If you weren't afraid of your property being damaged you wouldn't care enough to keep plywood around for such a contingency.

[BMdblU]

Originally Posted by damadama

lets the carjacker take your car if he has a gun on you. thats why you have insurance. Chances are he won't think twice about filling your back seat with brains if you try something funny.

If I aint gots no guns who gonna be protect me and my family?! cough don't be ignorant, you arent the criminal ... you are the yuppy bitch in the bmw thats about to get pistol whipped and/or shot. Your mindset is why we have so many fuckin retards such as yourself carrying around guns thinking they are somehow helping the problem.

[FStop7]

Originally Posted by anmcguire

Fear.

To quote Inigo Montoya: "You keep on using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

Preparedness ≠ Fear.

[radix]

Originally Posted by FStop7

To quote Inigo Montoya: "You keep on using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

You'd be wrong then.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fear

fear
   /fɪər/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [feer] Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. a distressing emotion aroused by impending danger, evil, pain, etc., whether the threat is real or imagined; the feeling or condition of being afraid.
2. a specific instance of or propensity for such a feeling: an abnormal fear of heights.
3. concern or anxiety; solicitude: a fear for someone's safety.
4. reverential awe, esp. toward God.
5. that which causes a feeling of being afraid; that of which a person is afraid: Cancer is a common fear.

As in, "I've a great fear[1] that if I'm not armed I won't be able to defend myself if I'm carjacked.", or "I keep a spare tire in my car because if I don't, I fear[3] I won't be able to get very far if I have a flat", or "A hurricane shattering my windows is no longer a fear[5], because I keep plywood around to prevent realization of that fear[5]."

Originally Posted by FStop7

Preparedness ≠ Fear.

I never said it did. What I said is that you can fear being unprepared. Ultimately this is why people bother to prepare themselves, for fear[3] (concern) of being caught unprepared.

[Artz 330]

WTF do you need a gun for when you can have this... no "Carry" permit required. LOL


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[Glacked]

It's also my opinion that pigs shouldn't be packing heat (too many bad pigs out there thinking they is 'the law'-- my attitude about cops comes from the god awful ones in the town I was a teenager in, maybe they arent all bad but I'm not going to take the opportunity to find out). So what do I do, stereotype and lump em all in 1 group. Of course you cant catch a criminal with a gun without a gun, right? I got a solution, get rid of handguns all together.

I came from a town with some bad cops, so I can appreciate where that comes from. I don't agree with it, but hey, it's a free country. My choice was to become one and make sure it got done the right way. I'm sure you could find a few folks who think I don't. They are generally dirving away with a ticket or watching the paint peel in prison.

I think this article sums up my views pretty well. I don't agree with a few items, but hell, I didn't write it.

ON SHEEP, WOLVES, AND SHEEPDOGS
By LTC(RET) Dave Grossman, RANGER, Ph.D.,author of "On Killing."

Honor never grows old, and honor rejoices the heart of age. It does so
because honor is, finally, about defending those noble and worthy
things that deserve defending, even if it comes at a high cost. In our time, that
may mean social disapproval, public scorn, hardship, persecution, or as always,
even death itself. The question remains: What is worth defending? What is worth
dying for? What is worth living for? - William J. Bennett - in a lecture to the
United States Naval Academy November 24, 1997

One Vietnam veteran, an old retired colonel, once said this to me:
"Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive
creatures who can only hurt one another by accident." This is true. Remember, the
murder rate is six per 100,000 per year, and the aggravated assault rate
is four per 1,000 per year. What this means is that the vast majority of Americans
are not inclined to hurt one another.

Some estimates say that two million Americans are victims of violent
crimes every year, a tragic, staggering number, perhaps an all-time record
rate of violent crime. But there are almost 300 million Americans, which
means that the odds of being a victim of violent crime is considerably less than one
in a hundred on any given year. Furthermore, since many violent crimes are
committed by repeat offenders, the actual number of violent citizens is considerably
less than two million.

Thus there is a paradox, and we must grasp both ends of the situation:
We may well be in the most violent times in history, but violence is still
remarkably rare. This is because most citizens are kind, decent people
who are not capable of hurting each other, except by accident or under extreme
provocation. They are sheep.

I mean nothing negative by calling them sheep. To me it is like the
pretty, blue robin's egg. Inside it is soft and gooey but someday it will grow
into something wonderful. But the egg cannot survive without its hard blue
shell. Police officers, soldiers, and other warriors are like that shell, and
someday the civilization they protect will grow into something wonderful.? For
now, though, they need warriors to protect them from the predators.

"Then there are the wolves," the old war veteran said, "and the wolves
feed on the sheep without mercy." Do you believe there are wolves out there
who will feed on the flock without mercy? You better believe it. There are evil
men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. The moment you forget
that or pretend it is not so, you become a sheep. There is no safety in
denial.

"Then there are sheepdogs," he went on, "and I'm a sheepdog. I live to
protect the flock and confront the wolf."

If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive
citizen, a sheep. If you have a capacity for violence and no empathy
for your fellow citizens, then you have defined an aggressive sociopath, a wolf. But
what if you have a capacity for violence, and a deep love for your fellow
citizens?
What do you have then? A sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking
the hero's path. Someone who can walk into the heart of darkness, into the
universal human phobia, and walk out unscathed

Let me expand on this old soldier's excellent model of the sheep,
wolves, and sheepdogs. We know that the sheep live in denial, that is what makes
them sheep. They do not want to believe that there is evil in the
world. They can accept the fact that fires can happen, which is why they want fire
extinguishers, fire sprinklers, fire alarms and fire exits throughout their kids'
schools.

But many of them are outraged at the idea of putting an armed police
officer in their kid's school. Our children are thousands of times more likely
to be killed or seriously injured by school violence than fire, but the
sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone
coming to kill or harm their child is just too hard, and so they chose the
path of denial.

The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the
wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The difference, though, is
that the sheepdog must not, can not and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheep
dog who intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished
and removed.
The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative
democracy or a republic such as ours.

Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that
there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them
where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our
airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much
rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, "Baa."

Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to
hide behind one lonely sheepdog.

The students, the victims, at Columbine High School were big, tough
high school students, and under ordinary circumstances they would not
have had the time of day for a police officer. They were not bad kids; they just had
nothing to say to a cop. When the school was under attack, however, and SWAT
teams were clearing the rooms and hallways, the officers had to physically peel
those clinging, sobbing kids off of them. This is how the little lambs
feel about their sheepdog when the wolf is at the door.

Look at what happened after September 11, 2001 when the wolf pounded
hard on the door. Remember how America, more than ever before, felt
differently about their law enforcement officers and military personnel? Remember how
many times you heard the word hero?

Understand that there is nothing morally superior about being a
sheepdog; it is just what you choose to be. Also understand that a sheepdog is a
funny critter: He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter, checking the
breeze, barking at things that go bump in the night, and yearning for a
righteous battle. That is, the young sheepdogs yearn for a righteous
battle. The old sheepdogs are a little older and wiser, but they move
to the sound of the guns when needed right along with the young ones.

Here is how the sheep and the sheepdog think differently. The sheep
pretend the wolf will never come, but the sheepdog lives for that day. After
the attacks on September 11, 2001, most of the sheep, that is, most citizens in America
said, "Thank God I wasn't on one of those planes." The sheepdogs, the warriors, said,
"Dear God, I wish I could have been on one of those planes. Maybe I
could have made a difference." When you are truly transformed into a
warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there.
You want to be able to make a difference.

There is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog, the warrior, but
he does have one real advantage. Only one. And that is that he is able
to survive and thrive in an environment that destroys 98 percent of the
population.
There was research conducted a few years ago with individuals
convicted of violent crimes. These cons were in prison for serious,
predatory crimes of violence: assaults, murders and killing law enforcement officers. The vast
majority said that they specifically targeted victims by body language: slumped
walk, passive behavior and lack of awareness. They chose their victims like
big cats do in Africa, when they select one out of the herd that is least able
to protect itself.

Some people may be destined to be sheep and others might be
genetically primed to be wolves or sheepdogs. But I believe that most
people can choose which one they want to be, and I'm proud to say that more and more Americans
are choosing to become sheepdogs.

Seven months after the attack on September 11, 2001, Todd Beamer was
honored in his hometown of Cranbury, New Jersey. Todd, as you recall, was the
man on Flight 93 over Pennsylvania who called on his cell phone to alert an
operator from United Airlines about the hijacking. When he learned of the other
three passenger planes that had been used as weapons, Todd dropped his phone
and uttered the words, "Let's roll," which authorities believe was a signal to
the other passengers to confront the terrorist hijackers. In one hour, a
transformation occurred among the passengers - athletes, business
people and parents. -- from sheep to sheepdogs and together they fought the wolves,
ultimately saving an unknown number of lives on the ground.

There is no safety for honest men except by believing all possible
evil of evil men. - Edmund Burke

Here is the point I like to emphasize, especially to the thousands of
police officers and soldiers I speak to each year. In nature the sheep, real
sheep, are born as sheep. Sheepdogs are born that way, and so are wolves.
They didn't have a choice. But you are not a critter. As a human being, you can be
whatever you want to be. It is a conscious, moral decision.

If you want to be a sheep, then you can be a sheep and that is okay,
but you must understand the price you pay. When the wolf comes, you and your
loved ones are going to die if there is not a sheepdog there to protect you. If
you want to be a wolf, you can be one, but the sheepdogs are going to hunt
you down and you will never have rest, safety, trust or love. But if you want
to be a sheepdog and walk the warrior's path, then you must make a conscious
and moral decision every day to dedicate, equip and prepare yourself to thrive
in that toxic, corrosive moment when the wolf comes knocking at the door.

For example, many officers carry their weapons in church.? They are
well concealed in ankle holsters, shoulder holsters or inside-the-belt
holsters tucked into the small of their backs.? Anytime you go to some form of
religious service, there is a very good chance that a police officer
in your congregation is carrying. You will never know if there is such an individual in your
place of worship, until the wolf appears to massacre you and your loved ones.

I was training a group of police officers in Texas, and during the
break, one officer asked his friend if he carried his weapon in church. The other
cop replied, "I will never be caught without my gun in church." I
asked why he felt so strongly about this, and he told me about a cop he knew who was at
a church massacre in Ft. Worth, Texas in 1999. In that incident, a mentally
deranged individual came into the church and opened fire, gunning down fourteen
people. He said that officer believed he could have saved every life that day
if he had been carrying his gun. His own son was shot, and all he could do
was throw himself on the boy's body and wait to die. That cop looked me in the
eye and said, "Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself
after that?"

Some individuals would be horrified if they knew this police officer
was carrying a weapon in church. They might call him paranoid and
would probably scorn him. Yet these same individuals would be enraged and would call for
"heads to roll" if they found out that the airbags in their cars were defective,
or that the fire extinguisher and fire sprinklers in their kids'
school did not work. They can accept the fact that fires and traffic accidents can
happen and that there must be safeguards against them.

Their only response to the wolf, though, is denial, and all too often
their response to the sheepdog is scorn and disdain. But the sheepdog
quietly asks himself, "Do you have and idea how hard it would be to live with
yourself if your loved ones attacked and killed, and you had to stand there
helplessly because you were unprepared for that day?"

It is denial that turns people into sheep. Sheep are psychologically
destroyed by combat because their only defense is denial, which is
counterproductive and destructive, resulting in fear, helplessness and
horror when the wolf shows up.

Denial kills you twice. It kills you once, at your moment of truth
when you are not physically prepared: you didn't bring your gun, you didn't
train. Your only defense was wishful thinking. Hope is not a strategy.
Denial kills you a second time because even if you do physically survive, you
are psychologically shattered by your fear helplessness and horror at
your moment of truth.

Gavin de Becker puts it like this in Fear Less, his superb post-9/11
book, which should be required reading for anyone trying to come to
terms with our current world situation: "...denial can be seductive, but it has an
insidious side effect. For all the peace of mind deniers think they get by saying it
isn't so, the fall they take when faced with new violence is all the more
unsettling."

Denial is a save-now-pay-later scheme, a contract written entirely in
small print, for in the long run, the denying person knows the truth on some
level.

And so the warrior must strive to confront denial in all aspects of
his life, and prepare himself for the day when evil comes.

If you are warrior who is legally authorized to carry a weapon and you
step outside without that weapon, then you become a sheep, pretending that
the bad man will not come today. No one can be "on" 24/7, for a lifetime.
Everyone needs down time. But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you
walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to
yourself...
"Baa."

This business of being a sheep or a sheep dog is not a yes-no
dichotomy. It is not an all-or-nothing, either-or choice. It is a matter of degrees,
a continuum. On one end is an abject, head-in-the-sand-sheep and on
the other end is the ultimate warrior. Few people exist completely on one end or the
other.
Most of us live somewhere in between. Since 9-11 almost everyone in America
took a step up that continuum, away from denial. The sheep took a few steps
toward accepting and appreciating their warriors, and the warriors started
taking their job more seriously. The degree to which you move up that
continuum, away from sheephood and denial, is the degree to which you and your loved
ones will survive, physically and psychologically at your moment of truth.

Btw, I come from a large family. Some believe in weapons and legally carry. Others loathe the idea of guns in the home and will never own/handle one. Guess which side calls for help the most.

[achenator]

Originally Posted by damadama

ooh sounds like u from teh hood dawg. funny cuz I lived in NOLA at a young age for about 6 years... lots of crime in the city but i never saw any of it firsthand

Actually I'm not from the hood but I have to drive through the hood at the worst times. I'm just saying that i've been to Austin several times and probably wouldn't carry a gun if I lived there but since I drive through some terrible areas at all hours, I carry. If I thought they wanted just my vehicle, fine they can have it but chances are that's not what they want.

[scollins]

Originally Posted by jaiman

Can you list all of these rights Canadians don't have?

Can I list all of them? No. But here are a few examples:

Right to bear arms - Canada has very restrictive firearms laws. Good luck owning a handgun up there, and you'll never get a permit to carry it for self defense. But hey, you don't really have the right to defend yourself either...

Right to self-defense - Can you explain this garbage to me, because I'm having a tough time with it:

Criminal Code, Sections 34-37


34. (1) Every one who is unlawfully assaulted without having provoked the assault is justified in repelling force by force if the force he uses is not intended to cause death or grievous bodily harm and is no more than is necessary to enable him to defend himself.

(2) Every one who is unlawfully assaulted and who causes death or grievous bodily harm in repelling the assault is justified if
(a) he causes it under reasonable apprehension of death or grievous bodily harm from the violence with which the assault was originally made or with which the assailant pursues his purposes; and
(b) he believes, on reasonable grounds, that he cannot otherwise preserve himself from death or grievous bodily harm.

35. Every one who has without justification assaulted another but did not commence the assault with intent to cause death or grievous bodily harm, or has without justification provoked an assault on himself by another, may justify the use of force subsequent to the assault if
(a) he uses the force
(i) under reasonable apprehension of death or grievous bodily harm from the violence of the person whom he has assaulted or provoked, and
(ii) in the belief, on reasonable grounds, that it is necessary in order to preserve himself from death or grievous bodily harm;
( b) he did not, at any time before the necessity of preserving himself from death or grievous bodily harm arose, endeavour to cause death or grievous bodily harm; and
(c) he declined further conflict and quitted or retreated from it as far as it was feasible to do so before the necessity of preserving himself from death or grievous bodily harm arose.

36. Provocation includes, for the purposes of sections 34 and 35, provocation by blows, words or gestures.

37. (1) Every one is justified in using force to defend himself or any one under his protection from assault, if he uses no more force than is necessary to prevent the assault or the repetition of it.
(2) Nothing in this section shall be deemed to justify the wilful infliction of any hurt or mischief that is excessive, having regard to the nature of the assault that the force used was intended to prevent.

In other words, if someone decides to beat you, but didn't mean to cause your death, and you fight back and manage to kill the person (knocked them out, they fell and hit their head on a rock), then YOU have committed a crime because you excessive force to protect yourself!?

AND, if the guy beating you without intent to kill you, feels that you are trying to kill him while defending yourself, then he can escalate his use of force against YOU?! The tables have been turned, and the attacker becomes the victim? What the hell?

In other words, you can only be a victim in Canada, and as soon as you move to defend yourself, you risk becoming a criminal by raising a hand to fight back. And you'll notice, these sections have nothing to do with firearms....

Does the name "Mark Steyn" and the "Human Rights Commission" mean anything to you? The mere fact that you guys put him on trial for articles written in a magazine is just ludicrous. Thankfully he was acquitted, but not before millions of dollars were wasted. Canadians don't enjoy nearly the "freedom of speech" or "freedom of the press" that Americans do.

[DanV1317]

The key is to find a good holster. I have a holster from http://ravenconcealment.com/. I have everything from g26 to g21sf that i can carry on 2+hour rides. I've gone though about 15-20 holsters, and i now have about 10 of these holsters. They make carrying so much easier. They can be converted IWB or OWB with jsut a switch of a few screws.

In the past, ive used blade tech, comp-tac, galco, tucker, bianchi, and many others. none compare to the raven products.

[Speedtrap]

Originally Posted by JoeyFiasco

good thing i only have to worry about being stabbed in the uk. for now..

The only pack I carry is between my legs when driving Enough to kill some.

[Scimitar335i]

I have the CQC Blackhawk holster for my glock 22 duty weapon. It fits really well with my body side and the way my e90 seats work...

[strider41]

Depending on the weather conditions outside the car and one's attire either due to the weather or while driving, and type of concealment desired for the environments, a cross draw, adjustable paddle or shoulder holster should work for most situations. A seat belt should not interfere with access to the firearm.

Personally, I like the adjustable paddle because of the flexibility it offers for either cross draw or strong side carry and the carry position on the waist can be adjusted without removing one's belt. YMMV