08-08-2020, 03:16 AM | #45 | |
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Statement from BMW i boss Robert Irlinger from AMS 18.3.2020 (with Google translation): "The vehicle concept of the iNext is a very long leap". There is "not the same vehicle again". Nevertheless, the iNext is "no architecture" or not the first car based on a new kit. Rather, it is designed in such a way that "all construction kits that we will also use in the large architectures get their first use in the iNext. And it is a pure electric car, there will be no combustion engine version. That sounds a bit like the beginning of a scalable e-car kit that shouldn't be called that yet." Also more info in Suddeutsche zeitung 20.3.2020: "The further development of FAAR and CLAR creates a common denominator for combustion engines, hybrids and e-vehicles - allegedly without compromising on function and production, but thanks to the scalable floor pan with more installation space for tank and / or batteries. The board of directors found the purely electric and correspondingly more radical ECAR matrix, which was originally intended to usher in the paradigm shift to battery drives in 2024, to be too expensive and initially put it on hold until 2030." Last edited by jollyjumper; 08-08-2020 at 03:25 AM.. |
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stein_325i25083.00 eddiehaug748.50 |
08-08-2020, 07:50 AM | #46 |
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Speak for yourself.
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08-08-2020, 08:06 AM | #47 |
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Coming along nicely.
Disguise slowly being peeled away.
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The M850i is evidence that BMW have got their mojo back when it comes to dynamic sports cars...
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08-08-2020, 08:09 AM | #48 |
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Seems like poor corporate leadership to direct a new controversial design language at the same time as a radically different powertrain. Many whom would have accepted the powertrain may not accept the styling, and vice versa.
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08-08-2020, 11:37 AM | #49 | |
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08-08-2020, 12:54 PM | #50 |
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Why all BMW electric cars needs to be ugly???
Same as the I3 this thing is also so "different". |
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08-08-2020, 11:51 PM | #51 | |
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Bland and totally generic
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08-09-2020, 10:57 AM | #52 |
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So if planned production is 2021 July when will people be able to place orders on these cars?
My sister is definitely interested in an EV SAV/SUV car but the Ix3 won't cut it for her due to what price they want for a car that will go a maximum of 300 km (wintertime) and only RWD. They seem to be adding a lot of production starts as of 2021 but still you can't place orders on many of the planned cars for 2021. Wonder if its the Covid effect is causing delays now on the ordering side of stuff.
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08-09-2020, 11:47 AM | #53 | |
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08-09-2020, 12:03 PM | #54 | |
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So she is gonna go from the G series 330i to an EV suv cause she had the X5 hybrid but it got stolen from her driveway and the insurance company had the 330i to offer. So long story short she doesn't want an estate car and wants to go back to SUV and EV but refuses the X or Y Tesla, Also informed her about the other options out there but no it is BMW or nothing for whatever reasons she has for that.
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08-09-2020, 12:23 PM | #55 |
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08-09-2020, 06:08 PM | #56 | |
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no way BMW can deliver a comparably priced BEV SUV with the same range as model X. their architecture, battery chemistry, BMS, motor tech, bev assembly line..etc are either behind what tesla can currently do or more expensive in cost. if it's got the same range, price will be $10k more. if it's the same price, range will be ~100 miles less. add "luxury brand badge" and "premium interior materials" to make up the difference and convince buyers. Honestly outlook isn't great for this car, expect sales numbers to be somewhere between the Ipace and etron. |
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08-09-2020, 11:52 PM | #57 | |
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One test drive is all it takes. |
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08-10-2020, 07:45 AM | #58 | ||
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You are correct, many don't care about any of these things which is my point, luxury manufacturers need you get you to buy into the Sales/Marketing as the substance gets closer and closer but BMW tries to sell at a premium. Some part of the buyers leave as the substance can be differentiated. Anyone most interested in best value or reliability likely doesn't have BMW anywhere near the top (earned or not). Anyone that does care about handling/powertrains and performance currently at least appreciates BMW and puts them on the list to consider of like priced brands. For the true "badge buyer", they don't need to know anything about the substance as it is mostly about the Sales/Marketing and the best hope for some manufacturers is these buyers never get educated or care about what is in the car.
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08-10-2020, 08:55 AM | #59 |
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Wouldn't this get terribly close to the iX3 in terms of size, design etc. ?
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08-10-2020, 08:57 AM | #60 |
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I believe the iNext is more like the X5 in terms of size and likely price as well. Not to mention this will be offered globally and with AWD unlike the iX3. However it will likely be brought out much later, as the iX3 is first, then the i4 which is aimed for the first half of 2022 (this was the goal before corona at least) and then the iNext, so it may be a while.
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08-10-2020, 09:03 AM | #61 | ||
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For the enthusiast, it shows up in a lower vehicle weight. Sure, in the current state of evolution, electric vehicles aren't light to begin with, but as time goes on we are going to see weight-optimized electric cars for enthusiasts and efficiency will be an important part of that. And again, like I say, everything in the drivetrain has already become very commoditized. Everyone is dipping into the same supplier pool for electronics, transmission, fuel systems, turbochargers, etc., and while engine block and heads (and a few other parts) are still made in house, the results are becoming less and less differentiated. So, the lack of competitive advantage in this area you cite isn't new - it has been slowly occurring over the past few decades as increasing regulatory concerns mount and weed out the solutions that aren't cost-competitive. By and large, we have already entered a period of ICE development dormancy, and the automakers are resting on what they've established as brand values over their history. The lion's share of R&D is now going into electric vehicle development. Quote:
Now, give Cadillac an electric drivetrain with a 350 miles of range and sub-15 minute to-80% charge times, and let's see if that gets attention. Of course BMW is gunning for the same thing, but GM is ahead if what we have heard about their new platform is true. Will this be enough to put in the dent in the market share? Maybe not soon. But if they are able to establish and retain at least some of that advantage as EV sales start to become significant late in the decade? We'll see. At any rate, to me there is potential for a lot more of substance to sell on than you have used to calculate your current position on the matter. I've tried to provide some factors to think about. We'll know in a few years as EV sales reach a significant enough volume to start to play a role in the market position of traditional automakers relative to one another. In my estimation, worst case is that today's already staid status quo is essentially maintained. Best case, some of the potential areas for gaining an advantage become realized, and we have a far more interesting contest to watch. |
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08-10-2020, 09:40 AM | #62 | |
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I think smaller manufacturers like BMW are far less likely to come out on top of the electric car compared to the larger companies as the amount of money they have to spend is smaller and the parts they produce and spread over all models doesn't have the advantages of the larger manufacturers. They also have the issue of trying to sell sport and luxury and the close to the highest prices in the market (I doubt even close to lowest cost) and when looking at it objectively buyers can't find as many differences as they did in the past. I think medium to long term they will struggle with both electric and autonomy as both require huge R&D budgets. Tesla is a unique situation where they were able to spend billions for many years and stockholders bought into the program where profits weren't required. They didn't have to worry about being profitable in the 98% of the market, were able to put all resources towards their end goal of electric/autonomy and the 2%. Time will tell if this will work out or if the others beat them on the things Tesla likely don't currently do as well on, like economies of scale, distribution, service.
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08-10-2020, 09:57 AM | #63 | |
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I respect your opinion, and you have reasonable points. There's enough nuance and strategic positioning in this competition to hold my interest. I'm not sure I'm rooting for any specific entity (although I don't want to see BMW left behind), but I do think there are some power players establishing themselves as we speak, and I think there are plenty of surprises coming this decade (yes, I've got my eye on you, Hyundai ). |
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08-10-2020, 12:56 PM | #64 |
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Wait- Isn't the iNext X3 sized? Are we really to expect X3 sized EV that is $10k MORE expensive than an X5!?!? OMG!
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08-10-2020, 01:41 PM | #65 |
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08-10-2020, 02:55 PM | #66 | |
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An iNext priced $10k above an X5/X6 would be challenged to justify itself if it were the same size as an X5/X6. It seems hard to envision an X3/X4 sized product commanding that kind of money without the Spirit of Ecstasy on the hood.
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