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      01-13-2019, 10:19 PM   #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XutvJet View Post
So you're OK with a President declaring a false national emergency and stealing funds from other government programs to make good with his small and misguided base. A majority in this country, like myself, support improving the illegal immigration safeguards in this country, but view the wall as a total and complete waste of time and money. Mitch went home because he's worried as hell about what Trump will do and what he may have to do to stop Trump. Trump's total disregard for rational thinking and pulling massive amounts of people into this mess of the shutdown is not going well in the GOP. If Trump declares a national emergency to get the funding, the democrats will sue him and the senate will likely fight him as well now. He has no support other than his base.

Do you guys not realize that building a wall or any structure for that matter will take years before ground is broken? It's not like you order the thing via Amazon Prime and put it together like Legos in a day. There's a lengthy engineering study process. Then they'll need to take private owners land through eminent domain (good luck). Then there's all the environmental groups that will sue as well as various parties that will bring suit. Again, years, perhaps decades.

Even if money was somehow appropiated, the thing would be shelved the moment Trump is gone.
Will you stick by your word and take the bet, or not?
Man up. You made a supposition and I'm calling you on it. Are you in or just talking BS?
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      01-13-2019, 10:26 PM   #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tracer bullet View Post
Some may argue this, but I don't think it's most, most think there are simply better uses of the money. This feels like other arguments being reframed so they can be more easily dismissed. You may disagree that there are better uses for the money, and that's fine, but don't lose sight of what is being argued about (correct or not).



Because conservatives and logical fallacies ??? And yes we all do it at times.



Huh, you know for certain that crime is under reported, then say there's no way to know what it is, then say there is data is out there? That feels like a bit of bouncing around. Should we just agree that we don't know if illegals commit mroe or less crime than anyone else and leave it at that? Or do you actually have data?



Wow, so now the wall can fix the health care system, schools, wages, AND the environment? Wow! Holy cow, if only everyone knew what you just discovered, everything would be solved!



Funny, even the conservative leaning Cato institute said the wall won't work, so is it anything other than hopes and feels that have some conservatives still clamoring for it?


I posted the info several times already, but the DHS is asking for... I think it was 1.6 billion... for border security for 2019. Let's agree to give them that, and get this whole thing behind us.
DUH. The ENTIRE CRIME RATE IS UNDERREPORTED. I WILL CALL YOUR ATTENTION TO ONE STATISTIC: RAPE LOOK IT UP, YOURSELF AND THEN GET BACK TO ME. IF THIS IS UNDERREPORTED, THE PLEASE TELL ME HOW THE REST ISN'T.

I RAN THE CENSUS DATA CENTER IN THE SOUTHEASTERN QUAD IN GRAD SCHOOL. I'LL TAKE YOU ON HEAD-TO-HEAD IN ANY STATISTICS INVOLVING POPULATION DATA IN THE US.

F'IN CHEERS-MK
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      01-13-2019, 10:34 PM   #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by other_evolved View Post
And Republicans used to be fiscally conservative, yet here we are. How do I know a politician is lying?
When their lips are moving and noise is emanating from their vocal pie-holes, regardless of party.

We all need to learn this. Once this is learned, we can take our country back.

Cheers-mk
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      01-13-2019, 11:09 PM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3.0L View Post
Israel's neighbors are not very friendly. You know: shooting rockets, mortars, guns and sh*t at them. Israel's wall seems justified.
I guess the drug cartels that use the border to smuggle tons of drugs into the US are up for a Nobel Peace prize this year.

Another point to ponder. Why do all these rich liberals have walls around their homes. I mean they already live in rich and exclusive neighborhoods so why the walls? It ain't like they are getting RPGs fired at them.
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      01-14-2019, 07:46 AM   #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
Yes I know bunch of softy fucks these days maybe safe spaces will get built on every corner too.
No way! I'm still waiting for my "taco truck on every corner" that hasn't happened. Get in line, pal.
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      01-14-2019, 07:50 AM   #292
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
It will work fine in conjunction with other means. It's a tool to stop most policy and policing will do rest.
No, it will stop *some* - not most. Again, most illegal immigrants overstay legit visas. No border wall is going to help that.

Assuming you're talking about illegal immigration here, you weren't real specific....
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      01-14-2019, 08:02 AM   #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottSinger View Post
Yeah, ask the Chinese.
Comparing an unmanned wall constructed thousands of years ago to a U.S. cutting age electronics, manned, modern construction wall is flat out ridiculous.
But you wouldn't dare ask that question of the Israelis about their new wall would you?
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      01-14-2019, 08:22 AM   #294
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We need to stop comparing this wall the the Israeli border. Israel built the wall around 2002 to stop suicide bombers. The people trying to cross into Israel are not trying to get in and make a living, they are trying to kill as many Israelis as possible. Every person that gets by is a huge threat.

Israel has justification to shoot people trying to break in, I highly doubt the US is planning on shooting at people, which makes the wall less effective.

As high tech as the Israeli wall is, they are now having to build an underground wall to stop tunnels. The wall in Israel works so well because of other deterrents in conjuction, the barrier alone wouldn't work.
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      01-14-2019, 08:58 AM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djsaad1 View Post
We need to stop comparing this wall the the Israeli border. Israel built the wall around 2002 to stop suicide bombers. The people trying to cross into Israel are not trying to get in and make a living, they are trying to kill as many Israelis as possible. Every person that gets by is a huge threat.

Israel has justification to shoot people trying to break in, I highly doubt the US is planning on shooting at people, which makes the wall less effective.

As high tech as the Israeli wall is, they are now having to build an underground wall to stop tunnels. The wall in Israel works so well because of other deterrents in conjuction, the barrier alone wouldn't work.
Yeah no shit and you don't think the wall will have high tech surveillance equipment installed on it.
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      01-14-2019, 09:04 AM   #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta0311 View Post
Yeah no shit and you don't think the wall will have high tech surveillance equipment installed on it.
Are we going to shoot them remotely when we see them on camera? Even on the small Israel border, the Israelis can't always get there fast enough to stop them.

In general I am for some type of barrier with technology to supplement. I agree it is a deterrent, and will stop some people from coming across.

But my point in the above post, is that we should stop comparing it to the wall in Israel, both from a funding and functionality standpoint. The wall in Israel saves much more lives than anything we build on our border, that is why we provide funds for it so easily. And the wall in Israel will always be a much better deterrent because of the consequences of trying to get past it.
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      01-14-2019, 09:13 AM   #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djsaad1 View Post
Are we going to shoot them remotely when we see them on camera? Even on the small Israel border, the Israelis can't always get there fast enough to stop them.

In general I am for some type of barrier with technology to supplement. I agree it is a deterrent, and will stop some people from coming across.

But my point in the above post, is that we should stop comparing it to the wall in Israel, both from a funding and functionality standpoint. The wall in Israel saves much more lives than anything we build on our border, that is why we provide funds for it so easily. And the wall in Israel will always be a much better deterrent because of the consequences of trying to get past it.
The whole point of the wall is to slow illegal immigration on the Southern border to a trickle, it creates a choke point. It won't stop everyone but it will slow things down by making it harder to cross.
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      01-14-2019, 09:27 AM   #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_clt View Post
No way! I'm still waiting for my "taco truck on every corner" that hasn't happened. Get in line, pal.
I don’t want taco trucks on my corners. You can get tacos anywhere. I want a tamales truck like they used to have in Denver.
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      01-14-2019, 09:31 AM   #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
F'IN CHEERS-MK
Chill. I'm sure all kinds of crimes from all over the place are under reported, illegal aliens, natural born citizens, all of the above. You seem to be taking a question pretty personally. I'm asking if, in the end, "should we just agree that we don't know if illegals commit more or less crime than anyone else and leave it at that?" It seems the answer to that is yes?
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      01-14-2019, 09:48 AM   #300
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      01-14-2019, 10:39 AM   #301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tracer bullet View Post
Chill. I'm sure all kinds of crimes from all over the place are under reported, illegal aliens, natural born citizens, all of the above. You seem to be taking a question pretty personally. I'm asking if, in the end, "should we just agree that we don't know if illegals commit more or less crime than anyone else and leave it at that?" It seems the answer to that is yes?
You made a statement that you can't support. Again.
You are also willing to completely forget that their first act is illegal and the rest are magnified from there, forward.

I don't just agree to disagree on hard data. I'm sorry...not how I roll.
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      01-14-2019, 11:05 AM   #302
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I'm really glad I don't have to have an opinion anymore. Thanks for telling me how it is, MKSixer
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      01-14-2019, 11:13 AM   #303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
You made a statement that you can't support. Again.
You are also willing to completely forget that their first act is illegal and the rest are magnified from there, forward.

I don't just agree to disagree on hard data. I'm sorry...not how I roll.
You're so frequently confusing. Which statement did I make this time that I can't support? Let's recap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tracer bullet
Huh, you know for certain that crime is under reported, then say there's no way to know what it is, then say there is data is out there? That feels like a bit of bouncing around. Should we just agree that we don't know if illegals commit more or less crime than anyone else and leave it at that? Or do you actually have data?
Those were just questions. Questions that you seem to have misinterpreted as "MK is a dumb bastard". If that's what you mean about an unsupported statement, my apologies. Just questions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tracer bullet
Chill. I'm sure all kinds of crimes from all over the place are under reported, illegal aliens, natural born citizens, all of the above. You seem to be taking a question pretty personally. I'm asking if, in the end, "should we just agree that we don't know if illegals commit more or less crime than anyone else and leave it at that?" It seems the answer to that is yes?
My first sentence, I guess you could consider it a statement. I was just trying to placate your all caps reply of "The ENTIRE CRIME RATE IS UNDERREPORTED." These were your words I was simply agreeing with.

My suggestion you were taking things a bit personally was an opinion. How I feel you take something isn't something really anyone can back up.

And then I asked my question again.

Here's another question - Do you have think we are arguing about something? FYI, we are not. Let me rephrase my question differently... If someone says that illegals commit fewer crimes than natural born citizens, is the correct response that they cannot make that claim and back it up with facts, that we just don't know? I have a feeling I'm on "your side" with this, but some how you've gotten a little pissed off about it.
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      01-14-2019, 11:32 AM   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tracer bullet View Post
You're so frequently confusing. Which statement did I make this time that I can't support? Let's recap.



Those were just questions. Questions that you seem to have misinterpreted as "MK is a dumb bastard". If that's what you mean about an unsupported statement, my apologies. Just questions.



My first sentence, I guess you could consider it a statement. I was just trying to placate your all caps reply of "The ENTIRE CRIME RATE IS UNDERREPORTED." These were your words I was simply agreeing with.

My suggestion you were taking things a bit personally was an opinion. How I feel you take something isn't something really anyone can back up.

And then I asked my question again.

Here's another question - Do you have think we are arguing about something? FYI, we are not. Let me rephrase my question differently... If someone says that illegals commit fewer crimes than natural born citizens, is the correct response that they cannot make that claim and back it up with facts, that we just don't know? I have a feeling I'm on "your side" with this, but some how you've gotten a little pissed off about it.
You are the one that sounds "pissed off". What does "Do you have think" mean?
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      01-14-2019, 11:49 AM   #305
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What does "Do you have think" mean?
Poor multitasking. Killing time here while I run tests, must have had one sentence in mind, left, and come back to finish another.
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      01-14-2019, 12:03 PM   #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tracer bullet View Post
You're so frequently confusing. Which statement did I make this time that I can't support? Let's recap.



Those were just questions. Questions that you seem to have misinterpreted as "MK is a dumb bastard". If that's what you mean about an unsupported statement, my apologies. Just questions.



My first sentence, I guess you could consider it a statement. I was just trying to placate your all caps reply of "The ENTIRE CRIME RATE IS UNDERREPORTED." These were your words I was simply agreeing with.

My suggestion you were taking things a bit personally was an opinion. How I feel you take something isn't something really anyone can back up.

And then I asked my question again.

Here's another question - Do you have think we are arguing about something? FYI, we are not. Let me rephrase my question differently... If someone says that illegals commit fewer crimes than natural born citizens, is the correct response that they cannot make that claim and back it up with facts, that we just don't know? I have a feeling I'm on "your side" with this, but some how you've gotten a little pissed off about it.
I'm not pissed at all. It was for effect. It worked.
I don't often get people saying I'm confusing. And someone's confusion going on in their head isn't on me.
Syntax can be your friend.
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      01-14-2019, 12:15 PM   #307
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Well, I'm still not sure what statements you think I made that I can't support, or if you agree we just can't say what the crime rate of illegals is compared to everyone else. I guess we'll never know. Glad you're not pissed off I guess.

The shutdown and wall didn't even make the main online page of our local paper. Might be in a holding pattern for a while longer.
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      01-14-2019, 12:22 PM   #308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
Will you stick by your word and take the bet, or not?
Man up. You made a supposition and I'm calling you on it. Are you in or just talking BS?
What are bet you talking about?

What are you calling me out on?

What BS am I talking?
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