BMW i
Forum for the BMW i3, i4 and i8
BMW i3 BMW i8
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

  BMW i Forums > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > Off-Topic Discussions Board > Politics/Religion

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      08-10-2017, 08:56 AM   #243
MightyMouseTech
Major General
MightyMouseTech's Avatar
3602
Rep
5,609
Posts

Drives: 13 135i 6MT LeMans Blue MSport
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Ottawa, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Put up yer stats son...

I was 47 years old when I first vehicle I bought a vehicle with an automatic in 2009. It has an automatic ONLY because the manual transmission'd 5-cylinder version was no longer available by late 2009; they were all sold out. I have over 1 million driving miles all on a manual transmission. I drive 800 miles a week to work in my E90 6sp MT in what is known as some of the worst traffic on the East coast. Took my drivers license in a manual transmission'd Ford Pinto. Paid my way through college as a courier using a manual transmission'd Ford Escort. The 5 motorcycles I've owned... Even my tractor is manual trans.

My wife too, is a staunch MT'er. Her first BMW was a MT, her VW Bug ragtop before that was an MT, before that a MGB manual, her current Z3... yup manual. Probably would have not married her if she wasn't. Just sayin'.

Bring it
I will put up another not sure about that.

I am 46, have owned about 30 different cars. Every single one of them has had a clutch. If the vehicle I thought I wanted only came with flappy paddle bullshit, well, I would not buy it, don't care how many boxes it ticks on my want list.
Appreciate 2
Efthreeoh6959.00
fbsm739.00

      11-01-2017, 04:00 PM   #244
NickyC
Major General
NickyC's Avatar
6268
Rep
6,446
Posts

Drives: YMB M4, has a roof though. :(
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Now in Miami! :D

iTrader: (17)

Tesla sets yet another record in Q3, though I doubt it's the kind of record Mr. Musk was hoping for. Tesla burned a record cash amount once again, $16m a day in Q3!!

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-1...-stock-tumbles

Honestly, how long can this company continue? Of course, the biggest surprise is that the stock didn't go up 20% on the news in this joke of a market.
Appreciate 0
      11-02-2017, 01:20 PM   #245
Law
Global Moderator
Law's Avatar
5044
Rep
2,153
Posts

Drives: E90 M3 6MT
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: -

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2011.5 BMW M3  [5.00]
2004 BMW M3  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Tesla sets yet another record in Q3, though I doubt it's the kind of record Mr. Musk was hoping for. Tesla burned a record cash amount once again, $16m a day in Q3!!

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-1...-stock-tumbles

Honestly, how long can this company continue? Of course, the biggest surprise is that the stock didn't go up 20% on the news in this joke of a market.
I called out a user here over 3-months ago.

I basically said people are batshit crazy if they really think they will be receiving their Model 3 before 2018. People thought I was trolling, but I wasn't.

Now it's November and Tesla has managed to produce a whopping 260 Model 3s while posting record losses.

It's just amazing that fanboys drank the kool-aid, blindly threw money at the project, planned their leases around this "schedule" and really expected everyone and their mom to receive their Model 3 by now.
__________________
2011.5 E90 ///M3 | 6-Speed Manual | Jerez Black | Fox Red |

| E9x M3 Press/Media Archives Thread | S65-based Racing Engines Thread |
Appreciate 1
NickyC6268.00

      11-02-2017, 04:00 PM   #246
Germanauto
Brigadier General
Germanauto's Avatar
United_States
4154
Rep
3,431
Posts

Drives: BMW, Lexus
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: NW, SoCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Law View Post
I called out a user here over 3-months ago.

I basically said people are batshit crazy if they really think they will be receiving their Model 3 before 2018. People thought I was trolling, but I wasn't.

Now it's November and Tesla has managed to produce a whopping 260 Model 3s while posting record losses.

It's just amazing that fanboys drank the kool-aid, blindly threw money at the project, planned their leases around this "schedule" and really expected everyone and their mom to receive their Model 3 by now.
Take it from somebody who worked with Tesla owning clients....these people are insufferable tech nerds with no knowledge of cars. It's just another gadget for them to show off.
Appreciate 2
Efthreeoh6959.00
P1et6557.50

      11-02-2017, 04:22 PM   #247
Red Bread
Major General
United_States
3538
Rep
8,502
Posts

Drives: Smog machines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Dallas, TX

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Is that really different from the average S63/65 or G63/65 owner?
Appreciate 1
Efthreeoh6959.00

      11-03-2017, 07:16 PM   #248
W///
Lieutenant General
W///'s Avatar
4352
Rep
10,978
Posts

Drives: 08 E92 M3 /07 Z4MR / 99 E36 M3
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SC

iTrader: (13)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obioban View Post
I had read that it was now at 500,000, but even at 400,000 it pretty well invalidates your statement of "they need a market to sell to. There isn't one in the US which is 90% of planned sales".

I don't know any Tesla owners who considered the price of gas in their purchase. 100% of them bought it because it was a better car/ownership experience. I could see that changing as the cars get cheaper (more cost sensitive ownership base), but I think your way to wrapped up in the price of gas. Silent running, not having to fill up, massive torque, and simplicity of design are all very compelling features, and Tesla is years ahead of everyone else on autopilot (and gaining fast with the rate their taking data in compared to anyone else on the market).
Surprised to see you liking the idea of a Tesla (I know this is an old post). The reason I say that is because you mentioned at some point that you sometimes found your M5 boring. I don't see how you wouldn't also be bored of a Tesla. Personally, I'm not against EVs (to lease, not own), but a Tesla does not entice me due to lack of dealerships where I live.

Anyway, back to the thread. I'm surprised that not many people have talked about their manufacturing, or how they shoot themselves in the foot (think rear doors from Tesla X or the fact they are woefully behind on building the 3).

I know a few people that work at Tesla, and a few suppliers that Tesla works with, and it really is very clear it's more of a tech company than manufacturing. I'm curious to see how this will all play out.
Appreciate 0
      11-04-2017, 09:57 AM   #249
jmg
Major General
jmg's Avatar
United_States
8549
Rep
9,666
Posts

Drives: F80 M3 CS, I01 i3 REx LCI
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Orange County, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Tesla sets yet another record in Q3, though I doubt it's the kind of record Mr. Musk was hoping for. Tesla burned a record cash amount once again, $16m a day in Q3!!

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-1...-stock-tumbles

Honestly, how long can this company continue? Of course, the biggest surprise is that the stock didn't go up 20% on the news in this joke of a market.
My stock took a big fucking dump on Thursday. I put a stop at $290. What's the latest on the rep tax bill? If the fed incentives go away I'm pulling out while I'm still ahead.
__________________
2018 F80 ///M3 CS - Lime Rock Grey Metallic | MPHAS | GC Camber Plates
2019 I01 i3 BEV - Giga World
Previous: F80 M3 | I01 i3 Rex LCI | I01 i3 REx | F30 340i M Sport ZTR | F30 328i Sport | Audi B7 S4 25Quattro #33 of 250 | E21 320i
Appreciate 0
      11-04-2017, 12:09 PM   #250
NickyC
Major General
NickyC's Avatar
6268
Rep
6,446
Posts

Drives: YMB M4, has a roof though. :(
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Now in Miami! :D

iTrader: (17)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
My stock took a big fucking dump on Thursday. I put a stop at $290. What's the latest on the rep tax bill? If the fed incentives go away I'm pulling out while I'm still ahead.
Good eye! If this is any indication, the incentives might be scrapped soon. This is assuming of course that the party in power, who controls everything can actually get it done.

http://www.sfgate.com/business/artic...n-12326732.php
Appreciate 0
      11-04-2017, 02:19 PM   #251
hellrotm
Major General
3027
Rep
6,409
Posts

Drives: F80
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ...Location...Location

iTrader: (0)

Telsa's Federal tax credits were due to expire soon anyways. The $7,500 credit halves when they reach 200,000 units sold in US(~ early 2018). Then halves again after 6 months. Then another six months it is $0. Basically sometime first quarter 2019.
Appreciate 0
      11-05-2017, 01:39 AM   #252
eluded
2JZ-GTE
eluded's Avatar
Bulgaria
2109
Rep
2,991
Posts

Drives: 340 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Sofia

iTrader: (0)

If the $7500 tax credit does not apply to the Tesla model three, things are going to get ugly especially if gas stays at the same price.
Appreciate 1
Efthreeoh6959.00

      11-05-2017, 05:01 AM   #253
Obioban
Emperor
1085
Rep
2,459
Posts

Drives: 05 M3, 04 M3iT , 01 M5, 17 i3
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: West Chester, PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2017 BMW i3  [0.00]
2005 BMW M3 Coupe  [0.00]
2004 BMW M3 Wagon  [0.00]
2001 BMW M5  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by W/// View Post
Surprised to see you liking the idea of a Tesla (I know this is an old post). The reason I say that is because you mentioned at some point that you sometimes found your M5 boring. I don't see how you wouldn't also be bored of a Tesla. Personally, I'm not against EVs (to lease, not own), but a Tesla does not entice me due to lack of dealerships where I live.

Anyway, back to the thread. I'm surprised that not many people have talked about their manufacturing, or how they shoot themselves in the foot (think rear doors from Tesla X or the fact they are woefully behind on building the 3).

I know a few people that work at Tesla, and a few suppliers that Tesla works with, and it really is very clear it's more of a tech company than manufacturing. I'm curious to see how this will all play out.
I look at it more along the lines of...

Once I've given up on driving a car I like (light weight NA high revving HPS manual) and go down the path of automation, I might as well go full bore and get something in exchange (not having to get gas, autopilot, reduced running costs). The EPS turbo automatic awd crap, for me, is just worse without any redeeming benefit in exchange.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      11-05-2017, 06:31 AM   #254
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
6959
Rep
14,151
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obioban View Post
I look at it more along the lines of...

Once I've given up on driving a car I like (light weight NA high revving HPS manual) and go down the path of automation, I might as well go full bore and get something in exchange (not having to get gas, autopilot, reduced running costs). The EPS turbo automatic awd crap, for me, is just worse without any redeeming benefit in exchange.
You and I have the same automotive tastes and feel the same way about the most recent modern cars being released. But I'm not sure you've driven an Electric. I had not driven one until Fox News started hammering on the Volt as being "Obama's Car" by forcing GM to build it as part of the auto industry bailout package. I know this to be untrue since GM had been working on the Volt as a project prior to Obama's administration, the tax credits for EVs were enacted during the Bush Administration, and GM with the 1990's EV1 has led the industry in my mind with EVs. Fox News was basically saying the Volt SUCKED and was totally funded by the US tax payer. So I decided to test drive a Volt; this was back in August 2012. I have to say I was quite surprised. The torque provided by the electric drivetrain and the shiftless transmission actually make for a nice driving experience. I've since driven a Volt one more time and depleted the battery to get it in gas mode with virtually any change driving performance, that was Spring of 2015. In March 2016 I test drove the Bolt twice.

Being a car enthusiast and an automatic transmission hater, what I found very likable about the EV drivetrain is actually that it behaves a lot like a manual transmission car. It does so because the purpose of driving a manual transmission is, when properly and actively executed the driver, to keep the vehicle's movement in the peak of the engine's power (torque and horsepower curves) to rapidly transgress in traffic. My disdain for automatics is they are programmed for fuel efficiency and are always in the wrong gear for aggressive driving. The EVs I've driven, albeit none are sports-oriented cars, were always in the correct gear because the linear torque available with electric motors. I could live with an EV DD if someone would make a sedan-based EV; and my daily driving includes a bunch of excellent back road work. Maybe the Tesla Model 3 is that car, other than the completely ridiculous dash panel and tablet gauge cluster. I'm hoping the future is a bit more bright than we think. It's a reality that the manual transmission is going obsolete (you can't find one on a dealer's lot unless its an M car or (Cadillac) V-series, I'm hoping I get to skip right to an EV.
__________________
A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission.
Appreciate 2
jmg8548.50
Viffermike1725.50

      11-05-2017, 07:16 AM   #255
Efthreeoh
Lieutenant General
United_States
6959
Rep
14,151
Posts

Drives: E90 & Z4 Coupe
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MARLAND

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Good eye! If this is any indication, the incentives might be scrapped soon. This is assuming of course that the party in power, who controls everything can actually get it done.

http://www.sfgate.com/business/artic...n-12326732.php
I wonder if Congress can actually pull the incentives since they were originally enacted under an energy bill rather than tax code legislation. There is a sunset built in to the incentives, which was the compromise back in 2007. What I think this is is a negotiation point. In order to get Democrat agreement on the 20% corporate tax level, it looks like the Republicans put the ceasing of the EV tax credits in the bill as a throwaway to get the 20% tax on business agreed to. I'd expect (hope) the price for US-built EVs to be lowered based on the lower corporate tax rate.

But really I think the price of gasoline has more of an effect on the takeup of EVs than the (max) $7,500 tax credit. Also, the tax credit only works for people who pay more than $7,500 in taxes, which to this point been a financial bonus to the purchase of an EV who really can afford not to get $7,500 taken off their taxes. Outside of the discussion of recharging time and range anxiety, based on my calculations, an EV needs to be priced around $35K to make the total cost of ownership equal with a gasoline equivalent vehicle. That's where the $7,500 rebate comes in to artificially lower the MSRP; in the US, $6/per gallon gasoline also makes the same equation work. We are not going to see $6 fuel in the US for awhile I suspect. Outside of the few percent of the population that either actually believes in globalwarmingclimatechange or cares about it and buy EVs for political correctness purposes, EVs are a hard sell. A bit less than 99% of the US private automotive fleet is ICE powered for a reason.

I never saw Tesla as a stock for long-term retirement funds. I've stated on this Forum many times that I can't see how Tesla can bring the Model 3 to market at 60% less price than the Model S. Even with the theoretical doubling of sales of the Model 3 vs. the Model S and the professional manufacturing help Tesla has brought to the Model 3 production, they can't get that much cost out of the manufacture of the Model 3 to lower the price by 60%.

My 2 cents.
__________________
A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission.
Appreciate 1
Viffermike1725.50

      11-21-2017, 11:14 AM   #256
hellrotm
Major General
3027
Rep
6,409
Posts

Drives: F80
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ...Location...Location

iTrader: (0)

“The company, folks, is going out of business,” he told CNBC in an interview Friday. “At this rate they'll never get to 2019.”

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/...ut-of-business
Appreciate 0
      11-22-2017, 09:37 AM   #257
shiv.nandak
Lieutenant
262
Rep
479
Posts

Drives: C7 Z06, 16' M4 6MT SO
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Pittsburgh

iTrader: (0)

I'm stocking up on tesla stocks :P - i look at the company the same way i look at Apple. All the non-enthusiast millennial hipsters will be all over tesla products soon.
Appreciate 0
      11-22-2017, 09:47 AM   #258
bimmer456
Major General
2116
Rep
5,495
Posts

Drives: 340i
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Pasadena, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv.nandak View Post
I'm stocking up on tesla stocks :P - i look at the company the same way i look at Apple. All the non-enthusiast millennial hipsters will be all over tesla products soon.
I'm stocking up on Apple shares and making boatloads if money .
Appreciate 0
      11-24-2017, 07:11 AM   #259
MrRoboto
Brigadier General
Canada
1752
Rep
4,836
Posts

Drives: VO 1M
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

Apple should buy Tesla and replace Tim Cook with Elon Musk.
Appreciate 0
      11-25-2017, 06:57 AM   #260
Obioban
Emperor
1085
Rep
2,459
Posts

Drives: 05 M3, 04 M3iT , 01 M5, 17 i3
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: West Chester, PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2017 BMW i3  [0.00]
2005 BMW M3 Coupe  [0.00]
2004 BMW M3 Wagon  [0.00]
2001 BMW M5  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRoboto View Post
Apple should buy Tesla and replace Tim Cook with Elon Musk.
He'd certainly be more proficient at spending Apple's $250,000,000,000+ pile of cash
__________________
Appreciate 0
      11-25-2017, 10:22 AM   #261
P1et
Major General
P1et's Avatar
United_States
6558
Rep
9,355
Posts

Drives: my wife's cars
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Texas

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv.nandak View Post
I'm stocking up on tesla stocks :P - i look at the company the same way i look at Apple. All the non-enthusiast millennial hipsters will be all over tesla products soon.
How can you afford a Tesla working at Starbucks?
Appreciate 0
      11-25-2017, 11:30 AM   #262
supra93
Major
United_States
1106
Rep
1,417
Posts

Drives: SLK, CLK, E500, Supra, RX7
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: LA

iTrader: (0)

Tesla reportedly burning through cash at rate of $8,000 per minute

Quote:
esla has burned through $4.2 billion over the past 12 months, spending cash at a rate of about $8,000 a minute as it struggles to ramp up production of its Model 3 sedan, reports Bloomberg, citing its own data. At that rate, the news outlet estimates Tesla will deplete its current cash reserves by Aug. 6, 2018.

That is, of course, a hypothetical financial projection that doesn't take into account income from the Model 3 or other products like its Model S luxury sedan, and it assumes Tesla continues its frenetic pace of spending. But it adds to a growing chorus of doubts and criticisms of the company as it struggles to produce the all-important Model 3 in meaningful numbers and reports sizable quarterly losses, even as it introduces a new electric-powered semi truck and Roadster sportscar.

Investors largely remain bullish on Tesla, whose shares were trading at $317.81 as of the close Tuesday and were up around 40 percent since the beginning of 2017. Tesla has a market capitalization of more than $53 billion, eclipsing the likes of Ford ($48 billion) and Fiat Chrysler (nearly $28 billion), despite those companies turning consistent quarterly profits.

Elon Musk has turned to taking reservations from customers as a way to get cash in the door. Consumers can reserve a Roadster, which doesn't come out until 2020, by putting down $50,000, while the Founders Series Roadster requires a $250,000 down payment. The latter is capped at 1,000 examples, meaning Tesla could generate $250 million in income. But bringing new products to the market will also add new costs.

"Whether they can last another 10 months or a year, he needs money, and quickly," Kevin Tynan, a senior analyst with Bloomberg Intelligence, told Bloomberg. He estimates that Tesla will need to raise $2 billion or more in fresh capital by mid-2018.

Separately, a Morgan Stanley analyst said he expects Tesla shares to be volatile next year before collapsing, according to Investor's Daily. In a note to clients, Adam Jones maintained an equal weight rating on Tesla with a price target of $379, but he issued a warning: "From a shorter-term trading perspective, we anticipate Tesla's stock price may reach highs in the range of $400 or more over the next few months before facing some more serious headwinds later in the year that could take the stock significantly below current levels."

Tesla has said it has enough money to meet its target of building 5,000 Model 3 sedans per week by the end of March, and expects to "generate significant cash flows from operating activities" after that point, per a letter to shareholders dated Nov. 1.
https://www.autoblog.com/2017/11/22/...ound-ab-tile-2
Appreciate 0
      11-25-2017, 12:26 PM   #263
shiv.nandak
Lieutenant
262
Rep
479
Posts

Drives: C7 Z06, 16' M4 6MT SO
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Pittsburgh

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by P1et View Post
How can you afford a Tesla working at Starbucks?
Haha true, not all of them are working for an hourly wage though. Also, most people can afford payments on a model 3 depending on how they value their disposable income. Its the same concept with broke people that buy an iPhone x for $1000+
Appreciate 0
      11-25-2017, 12:36 PM   #264
MalibuBimmer
Founder, Knights of the Roundel website
MalibuBimmer's Avatar
United_States
958
Rep
1,726
Posts

Drives: 2015 M4 and 2018 AMG GT
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: The Santa Monica Mountains, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2018 Mercedes AMG GT  [0.00]
2018 Audi Q3  [0.00]
2015 BMW M4  [5.00]
Quote:
Tesla reportedly burning through cash at rate of $8,000 per minute
Sounds like my ex wife.
__________________
Previously: 2014 i8; 2013 650i convertible; 2013 650i Gran Coupe; 2013 X1; 2010 550i GT; 2010 535 GT; 2010 Z4 3.5; 2008 535ixt; 2007 M6 convertible; 2006 650i convertible; 1996 Z3; 1980 633CSi; 1978 630CS; 1972 3.0CS; 1971 Bavaria. (1971; 1979-2005 & 2017 - ? -- the Mercedes years.)
Appreciate 5
yousefnjr1600.50
Sedoy320.50
Robin_NL5069.50
feuer3193.50

Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:01 AM.




bmw
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST