[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by ggalanis

As I have heard mentioned by some professional reviewers, with EVs you don't really feel differences in the powertrain when you option a more powerful car. A similarly equipped ix 40 will feel the same under normal driving as the 50 until you ask the engine for more power than the 40 can deliver. With a traditional gas engine, you get that different feeling from different power bands, you get different sounds. This just means that even when you don't ask the more powerful engine for more power than the lesser engine can provide, it still feels different and more special.

I feel that car companies will need to make less subtle styling differences between models to entice people to get the more sporty variants because as the base EVs can be decently powerful, a rational buyer will just get that one instead... Unless of course they purposely do something like giving the lesser powered version a smaller battery to force some people into getting the bigger battery version that come with a more powerful engine... But that would be mean right BMW?

Well said. For the time being it seems like the higher performance EVs look about the same and are substantially heavier. I'm talking everything from Model 3 Performance, EQS AMG, i4 M50, etc. Whereas with ICE cars you can immediately feel the difference in the sounds, vibrations, and overall dynamics between different tiers within the same model range.

Will be interesting to see how EV technology evolves and how manufacturers aim to create more product differentiation beyond just styling, interior, and tech.

[Cortexiphan]

I see absolutely no reason to take M60 over 50.
I did test drive the 50, it's an amazing machine; feels like Science Fiction. And the performance is at a level that I can't think my stomach can handle anything more.

Also, for EVs I don't think performance matters at all after a certain point. When you upgrade from an 330i to M340i, I don't think 0-60 is the sole reason; sound, the smoothness, the overall feel of the I6 engine makes it not only a faster car but a more premium experience - at least different. EVs all feel the same, same amount of smoothness, same kind of bottom heavy balance, same kind of torquey power delivery. Performance is not a worthy differentiator between these cars. They need to make more changes for people to pay more for the high end models. At least in the future, when people will realize this.

[pL86]

This is how the BMW M CEO differentiate between M and M Performance - M cars are for the track:

One point that deserves to be clarified is that the iX M60 is not the electric equivalent to the V8-powered X5 M. It's not a full-blown M car.

“It's an M Performance vehicle, not a high-performance version,” BMW M boss Frank van Meel told me. “Our target for the M Performance cars is always to give the driver more power and more precision. We change the chassis setup so that it's more direct and the body control is better without going as far as making a track vehicle like the high-performance ones. The gap between the series-production [iX] and a pure M was so big that customers demanded, 'could you give me more M character, but not for the track? You can develop it on the track, but please don't give me a car for the track. I just want more performance and a better chassis, but don't make it too hard.'“

https://www.autoblog.com/2022/05/24/bmw-ix-m60-review/

And the Motor Trend review quantifies the suspension tweaks for the M60:

Making the xDrive50's air suspension and adaptive damping standard equipment means much of what differentiates the two variants is programming. The 2023 BMW iX M60 targets improved responsiveness by firming up the dampers more quickly when the steering wheel is turned to improve turn-in bite, or when encountering bumps and dips to control ride motions more tightly, for example. One crucial hardware revision: The anti-roll bars are stiffened by 10 percent in front, 20 percent in back to increase roll control in such a way as to improve front-end grip slightly.

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...-drive-review/

Some of the reviews have said the M60's ride is too rough and unsettled at high speeds.

[NomoTesla]

Great reviews that reaffirm my decision to purchase the M. All of the additional HP is available without launch control, which will make for a great all around performance experience. This is thanks to the specially designed rear motor only for the M version.

I appreciate beefier roll bars for added stability, the extra wide 275 tires, and the suspension modifications that improve cornering agility while also making the car feel less floaty.

What does M mean to me? It means the highest performance variant. Whatever else M means to other people I don't care about. I'm coming from a Tesla and there is absolutely 100% a big difference between EV driving experiences. They are not at all the same by any stretch of the imagination anymore than a Prius shares the same driving attributes of an M3.

[225]

I saw an ix in the flesh today and it all looked surprisingly OK bar the fake cr8p grille. Just looked like a heap bit of plastic slapped on the front of an Suv.

Either way these hold no appeal and while we are forced to go electric I'd still rather have some walk up appeal to me personally.
If we have to lose the anticipation of hearing an i6 or v8 cold start at least give us something nice to look at!

[Ziosella]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

I'm coming from a Tesla and there is absolutely 100% a big difference between EV driving experiences. They are not at all the same by any stretch of the imagination anymore than a Prius shares the same driving attributes of an M3.

The driving dynamics 4sure yes..the feeling that the chassis, steering, suspension give...clearly Model3 is different from I4 different from Kia EV6 etc. But they were talking about the sensations given by the engine/gearbox...the differences for example between an L4AMG and an L6 Bmw; between a Porsche boxer6 and a Ferrari V8. Different engines for different feeling. Electric vehicles are the death of these differences; if you tell me that you are able to recognize the "personality" of a BMW electric motor and distinguish it from Teslas with similar output... well sorry but I don't believe you.

[NomoTesla]

Originally Posted by Ziosella

The driving dynamics 4sure yes..the feeling that the chassis, steering, suspension give...clearly Model3 is different from I4 different from Kia EV6 etc. But they were talking about the sensations given by the engine/gearbox...the differences for example between an L4AMG and an L6 Bmw; between a Porsche boxer6 and a Ferrari V8. Different engines for different feeling. Electric vehicles are the death of these differences; if you tell me that you are able to recognize the "personality" of a BMW electric motor and distinguish it from Teslas with similar output... well sorry but I don't believe you.

Thanks for the context. Perhaps it is because I never took pleasure in hearing the loud sounds produced by gasoline engines. They have always been nuisances to me. I was primarily referring to driving dynamics and the "feeling" of driving each car. Tesla motors do exhibit an annoying whine.

[Bird~Dawg]

Originally Posted by Ziosella

The driving dynamics 4sure yes..the feeling that the chassis, steering, suspension give...clearly Model3 is different from I4 different from Kia EV6 etc. But they were talking about the sensations given by the engine/gearbox...the differences for example between an L4AMG and an L6 Bmw; between a Porsche boxer6 and a Ferrari V8. Different engines for different feeling. Electric vehicles are the death of these differences; if you tell me that you are able to recognize the "personality" of a BMW electric motor and distinguish it from Teslas with similar output... well sorry but I don't believe you.

From what I've read, the BMW electromagnet motor tech pulls noticeably harder through the rev range up to the "red line" than the permanent magnet tech in other EVs due to the ability to control / vary the field strength in electromagnets. I would think that this qualifies as a different feel.

[sor]

Originally Posted by Bird~Dawg

From what I've read, the BMW electromagnet motor tech pulls noticeably harder through the rev range up to the "red line" than the permanent magnet tech in other EVs due to the ability to control / vary the field strength in electromagnets. I would think that this qualifies as a different feel.

Yes, there's definitely a difference in driving feel. There are several factors like your regen preference, the "overdrive boost" like my e-tron has, different torque curves, then there's this "rumble" feature demoed on the M60 during launch control. Also torque split and the differential feel that would allow for drifting, etc.

[Buju]

Originally Posted by Cortexiphan

I see absolutely no reason to take M60 over 50.
I did test drive the 50, it's an amazing machine; feels like Science Fiction. And the performance is at a level that I can't think my stomach can handle anything more.

Also, for EVs I don't think performance matters at all after a certain point. When you upgrade from an 330i to M340i, I don't think 0-60 is the sole reason; sound, the smoothness, the overall feel of the I6 engine makes it not only a faster car but a more premium experience - at least different. EVs all feel the same, same amount of smoothness, same kind of bottom heavy balance, same kind of torquey power delivery. Performance is not a worthy differentiator between these cars. They need to make more changes for people to pay more for the high end models. At least in the future, when people will realize this.

This is my feeling as well. It's an incremental improvement in straight line speed that would be hard to appreciate on the public road.

[sor]

You're right, but one word of caution - don't drive them back to back, and if you do don't start with the M60

Obviously that's hard to do right now because of availability, so it's probably not an issue!

I made the mistake of just taking a different <4s BMW around the block while waiting for my iX test drive and it's noticeable. Sort of took the fun out of trying the iX xDrive 50, it was a mistake. The M60 is a torque monster even without launch control so I imagine in city driving the difference is going to be very apparent off the line with the heavy EV.

Either way it's still more power than anyone really needs, that's for sure.

[TXSchnee]

The 50 is certainly enough, which is why the waiting list is very long. I will be getting the M60 because the waiting list is non existent and the reduction in range doesn't matter to me. Maybe I am an outlier, but my guess this is close to the same reasons most of the people buying an M60 are getting one.

[tuffcalc]

Originally Posted by TXSchnee

The 50 is certainly enough, which is why the waiting list is very long. I will be getting the M60 because the waiting list is non existent and the reduction in range doesn't matter to me. Maybe I am an outlier, but my guess this is close to the same reasons most of the people buying an M60 are getting one.

What is your delivery estimate for an M60? I heard the opposite - long line.

[TXSchnee]

Originally Posted by tuffcalc

What is your delivery estimate for an M60? I heard the opposite - long line.

I am number 2 on my dealerships M60 wait list and number 15 for a 50. At least in Austin it appears the 50 is much more in demand.

[760Lifan]

The reason why I would probably focus on the 60 is a different one. Performance-wise, the 50 certainly is enough but what I'd not be willing to accept is to fall victim to option-cutting again.

I can live with a bit less power but would NOT be willing to give up the Bowers & Wilkins...

[JonoNZ]

Originally Posted by 760Lifan

The reason why I would probably focus on the 60 is a different one. Performance-wise, the 50 certainly is enough but what I'd not be willing to accept is to fall victim to option-cutting again.

I can live with a bit less power but would NOT be willing to give up the Bowers & Wilkins...

This summarises my feelings and the reason I jumped on the opportunity to grab a M60 that was available locally here for delivery next month.

I am pleasantly surprised by the reviews though - and some of the differences between the 40/50 and the M60 appeal to me.

[CaboM4]

Originally Posted by tuffcalc

What is your delivery estimate for an M60? I heard the opposite - long line.

Mine is built and awaiting carrier transport to NJ port of entry

[jsclarke99]

FYI I was curious about the actual price difference using the US configurator. My all options 2022 M50 is $104,025. An identically equipped 2023 M60 is $113,675, so a difference of $9,650.

$1,900 of that difference is due to a price increase for the base car and leather interior, from 2022 to 2023.

[CaboM4]

Originally Posted by jsclarke99

FYI I was curious about the actual price difference using the US configurator. My all options 2022 M50 is $104,025. An identically equipped 2023 M60 is $113,675, so a difference of $9,650.

$1,900 of that difference is due to a price increase for the base car and leather interior, from 2022 to 2023.

Are you sure this is accurate?

The M60 increase isn't applied until July 1, 2022 ... the base price is still showing 105,100 for vehicles produced before 7/1/2022. I did notice today that the BMW USA configurator for the M60 was updated to reflect the 7/1 base price of $108,900 (but the option packages are missing, so the configurator is still not 100% correct to BMW NA Ordering Guide)

[blake6551]

My M60 just went into the production queue, originally estimated to be Dec/Jan now delivery estimated early September.

[CaboM4]

Originally Posted by blake6551

My M60 just went into the production queue, originally estimated to be Dec/Jan now delivery estimated early September.

congrats!

[MrMoose0987]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

I'm coming from a Tesla and there is absolutely 100% a big difference between EV driving experiences.

Agreed. For me, my last few years of car ownership have been a mess as I try to find my long term car, and I've had 4 cars in this time frame, and the iX M60 will be my 5th. In this time, I've owned a Honda Clarity (which could drive full EV mode) and a Tesla Model Y, and I've tested a Mach E, an Ioniq 5, an Audi E-Tron, and an iX xDrive 50 (There wasnt a test M60, so I tested the 50 instead). Each of them felt vastly different. The Ioniq threw me around like nobody's business and the acceleration didn't feel good. The ETron acceleration felt way different as did the general driving dynamics. The Tesla was super smooth in the acceleration but sounded like a rickety wagon that was going to fall apart no matter what. The Mach E was kind of in the middle in all areas and inoffensive.

But when I drove the xDrive 50? It felt vastly different from any other electric I drove. It had the smoothness that the Tesla had but felt like it punched it harder than the Tesla did. The steering felt better, and the car didn't feel cheaply made whatsoever.

I do think there's enough room for differentiation in EV Driving Experiences, though I don't think they're as pronounced as different ICE engines. But I do think they're definitely noticeable and different enough to base a purchase decision around.