[rebekahb]

Originally Posted by LemansE90335xi

We can only purchase alcohol in gov't stores and a few select gov't licensed convenience stores way out in the boonies and it has to be transported beyond the reach of the driver meaning in the trunk, hatch or in the box of a pick-up truck. We can't take any booze out of a restaurant or drink while walking down a sidewalk. It's so nice to travel somewhere where you can have a sociable drink while strolling down the street and not feel like a criminal.

Oh wow, that's pretty strict. I would either A. Drink a lot less or B. Buy tons of liquor/wine at a time.

It so strange to me that other places especially more tourist types of areas don't allow drinking and strolling. When we were skiing in Breckinridge, CO a few months ago the people there were happy because they could sell to go drinks because of the pandemic. They had to plaster this goofy sticker to the cup which is weird.

[Fly320s]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

It's that burnt out tail light that leads to the kidnapping arrest. It's the baby shoe hanging from the rear view mirror that leads to the illegal gun possession charge. It's expired registration that leads to the arrest of a wanted felon.

Those are black and white example of breaking the law. Maybe inadvertently, but that really doesn't matter.

In most cases the law does defer to the citizen. I might make 30 traffic stops and only cite for a few of them while 90% of them receive a warning and advisement.

That is not law that defers to the citizen. That is you using your discretion to not cite the driver. You pulled them over for a reason. Was the reason because of a clear violation of the law? Or was the reason because you wanted to fish for a bigger catch so you used the nuances of the law to pull someone over?

That is the problem I have: the fishing expedition. That type of law enforcement needs to be reined in. There are way too many laws on the books for any one person to know and follow, which leads to every person breaking some obscure law every day. That, plus police officers looking for a "big catch" and prosecutors looking to make a name for themselves, lead to over zealous enforcement.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Fly320s

Those are black and white example of breaking the law. Maybe inadvertently, but that really doesn't matter.

That is not law that defers to the citizen. That is you using your discretion to not cite the driver. You pulled them over for a reason. Was the reason because of a clear violation of the law? Or was the reason because you wanted to fish for a bigger catch so you used the nuances of the law to pull someone over?

That is the problem I have: the fishing expedition. That type of law enforcement needs to be reined in. There are way too many laws on the books for any one person to know and follow, which leads to every person breaking some obscure law every day. That, plus police officers looking for a "big catch" and prosecutors looking to make a name for themselves, lead to over zealous enforcement.

It's both! That's how policing works. That's the whole concept behind reasonable suspicion and probable cause. It can't be reined in because you'd effectively disable policing. Without the ability to be proactive, what's the point of having police?!? We are already primarily reactionary as it is. Do you not want cops to be proactive and look for crime/criminals?!? I can tell you with absolute certainty that absent a call for service, proactive fishing is how you catch bad guys.

[TiMSport]

Originally Posted by LemansE90335xi

We can only purchase alcohol in gov't stores and a few select gov't licensed convenience stores way out in the boonies and it has to be transported beyond the reach of the driver meaning in the trunk, hatch or in the box of a pick-up truck. We can't take any booze out of a restaurant or drink while walking down a sidewalk. It's so nice to travel somewhere where you can have a sociable drink while strolling down the street and not feel like a criminal.

Such contrast when you consider pot is legal in all of Canada. Lol. That's one thing I doubt will ever happen here in the deep South.

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by rebekahb

Oh wow, that's pretty strict. I would either A. Drink a lot less or B. Buy tons of liquor/wine at a time.

It so strange to me that other places especially more tourist types of areas don't allow drinking and strolling. When we were skiing in Breckinridge, CO a few months ago the people there were happy because they could sell to go drinks because of the pandemic. They had to plaster this goofy sticker to the cup which is weird.

LOL I tend to fall under the "B" category. That sticker is foolishness that some lawyers came up with as a way to cover their collective asses and to ensure hassle-free prosecution of anyone dumb enough to drink while driving. I wonder how well it worked.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by LemansE90335xi

LOL I tend to fall under the "B" category. That sticker is foolishness that some lawyers came up with as a way to cover their collective asses and to ensure hassle-free prosecution of anyone dumb enough to drink while driving. I wonder how well it worked.

Agreed! Prosecution made easy for sure.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

The point is you were wrong. Furthermore, an officer in New York could still effectively detain (...and uncover other issues concerning that person). Like I stated earlier, we are looking for more.

Probable cause....

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Are you implying she's dumb with the "Lucy" reference?!? And you wonder why we talk to you the way we do.....

Your unvelt is showing!

For the same reason you call me Littlebear, instead of Mr. Murphy. The pic is of Lucille Ball, on of my all time favs.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Littlebear

Your unvelt is showing!

The pic is of Lucille Ball, on of my all time favs.

I apologize......this time!

Originally Posted by Littlebear

Probable cause....

Reasonable suspicion comes first lil' homie.


....and by more I meant significant violations of law, not necessarily the minor stuff used to effect the detention.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I apologize......this time!

Why you...!

Reasonable suspicion comes first lil' homie.

Reasonable being the operative word in the hood, then.

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by TiMSport

Such contrast when you consider pot is legal in all of Canada. Lol. That's one thing I doubt will ever happen here in the deep South.

Pot falls under all the same laws as alcohol and tobacco meaning you can drink more places than you can puff. Smoking is banned in all restaurants and bars as well as all public spaces, including sidewalks, parks, public buildings, shopping malls except in a few designated smoking areas. There are 91 DSAs in the city. Basically if you want to have a toke you do it in the privacy of your own home.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Meh, I usually grab one or two beers and head out for a walk along the road. It's public but a dead end so not a lot of traffic. How much trouble would I be in Murf993 ?

That depends.

The Liquor Licence Act says that you can consume alcohol in or on private property, a common area or a licensed premise. Common area is the hallway or an apartment building or say the front lawn of your condo property.

It is an offence to consume alcohol on public property, so the street or in a park, or in a motor vehicle. The fines aren't very big (except in a motor vehicle) and you'll also get your booze seized. Having said that, it's legal to smoke a blunt anywhere you like practically, so I suspect most coppers would ignore it but please don't leave your empties on the road or in the park.

I normally cautioned folks when I got them drinking where they shouldn't, unless they failed the attitude test.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Littlebear

Reasonable being the operative word in the hood, then.

No type of policing is ever reasonable in the hood. The mere use of the word is a misnomer.

[TiMSport]

Originally Posted by LemansE90335xi

Pot falls under all the same laws as alcohol and tobacco meaning you can drink more places than you can puff. Smoking is banned in all restaurants and bars as well as all public spaces, including sidewalks, parks, public buildings, shopping malls except in a few designated smoking areas. There are 91 DSAs in the city. Basically if you want to have a toke you do it in the privacy of your own home.

I see. As far as I know, it's the same in the US where pot is legal. As you alluded to, smoking in general is essentially restricted in most places.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

No type of policing is ever reasonable in the hood. The mere use of the word is a misnomer.

then why did you use the word?

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Littlebear

then why did you use the word?

I can't with you today. I'm just too tired!

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by LemansE90335xi

Pot falls under all the same laws as alcohol and tobacco meaning you can drink more places than you can puff. Smoking is banned in all restaurants and bars as well as all public spaces, including sidewalks, parks, public buildings, shopping malls except in a few designated smoking areas. There are 91 DSAs in the city. Basically if you want to have a toke you do it in the privacy of your own home.

Not in Ontario, the place reeks of weed now. And then theirs the edibles. You can't smoke inside public spaces, but it's pretty out of control here now. You can sit in a playground smoking a joint no problem but don't have a bottle of wine or beer with your picnic in the same park. We have lost the plot.

[Fly320s]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

It's both! That's how policing works. That's the whole concept behind reasonable suspicion and probable cause. It can't be reined in because you'd effectively disable policing. Without the ability to be proactive, what's the point of having police?!? We are already primarily reactionary as it is. Do you not want cops to be proactive and look for crime/criminals?!? I can tell you with absolute certainty that absent a call for service, proactive fishing is how you catch bad guys.

I get it. The problem I have is that you cast your net far and wide to catch the bad guys before they act again, but you also catch us non-criminals (non-violent criminals). The people you are looking for make up less than 1% of the population, but the laws, and police tactics apply to 100% of the population. And you will absolutely use your abilities to apply pressure to the non-violent criminals if they are "behaving like an ass."

As an experienced officer, you may be able to target certain areas, neighborhoods, car types, etc., that are more likely to contain the bad guys, but you will still catch good guys, too. The bad guys don't care if you use targeted enforcement, or your gut feeling, or whatever to catch them. They are used to being caught and dealing with the system. We good guys are not used to any of that, so we are much more likely to criticize or complain about the cop's "forceful" (my word) tactics. Which is kind of why we are where we are today.

The public has a pretty low opinion of law enforcement these days. It isn't all because of cops shooting "unarmed" bad guys. Or because cops botch an arrest and the suspect dies. Or because the FBI does a no-knock raid on a guy suspected of tax fraud. Those are just high-profile, rare cases.

I think that most people feel intimidated whenever they have to interact with the police. I know I do. Police officers aren't friendly. They are professional and direct to the point of being short, but friendly is not part of it. Also, like you said, many cops are searching for a bigger criminal. Maybe those cops push a little harder with the verbal judo to get a suspect to slip up, which seems like the cop is being a hard-ass to the person being stopped.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I apologize......this time!
.....

It's OK cowboy. Just go easy on the trigger finger.

[Buug959]

Originally Posted by Murf993

That depends.

The Liquor Licence Act says that you can consume alcohol in or on private property, a common area or a licensed premise. Common area is the hallway or an apartment building or say the front lawn of your condo property.

It is an offence to consume alcohol on public property, so the street or in a park, or in a motor vehicle. The fines aren't very big (except in a motor vehicle) and you'll also get your booze seized. Having said that, it's legal to smoke a blunt anywhere you like practically, so I suspect most coppers would ignore it but please don't leave your empties on the road or in the park.

I normally cautioned folks when I got them drinking where they shouldn't, unless they failed the attitude test.

Apparently ON isn't nearly as strict with their smoking restrictions as NS. Weed is treated the same as tobacco and vaping as far as where it can be enjoyed as well as falling under age restrictions and intoxication laws very similar to alcohol here.
Public smoking, vaping and toking are banned pretty much everywhere in the city. Exceptions being smoking and vaping are allowed in any of the 91 Designated Smoking Areas scattered around the city.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I can't with you today. I'm just too tired!

Fine!!
But no banana pics, pls.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by LemansE90335xi

Apparently ON isn't nearly as strict with their smoking restrictions as NS. Weed is treated the same as tobacco and vaping as far as where it can be enjoyed as well as falling under age restrictions and intoxication laws very similar to alcohol here.
Public smoking, vaping and toking are banned pretty much everywhere in the city. Exceptions being smoking and vaping are allowed in any of the 91 Designated Smoking Areas scattered around the city.

It was a real problem here before legalization, people were smoking everywhere and producing their prescriptions. It was getting ugly because they were being really belligerent about it.