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      01-20-2022, 10:01 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarMan77 View Post
We can compare and debate the value prop of the i4 vs the Taycan. However, the Taycan buyer is not cross shopping the i4. Probably vice versa.
I am cross shopping the iX, a Taycan 4S Cross Turismo (on waiting list), the Hummer 3X SUV (put down a $100 deposit), and a Rivian R1S. Prices ranging from $80k-$140k. The main issue right now is that there are so few directly comparable, good to drive BEVs out there. So yes, people are cross shopping the Taycan, i4 and probably Tesla.
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      01-20-2022, 10:04 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarMan77 View Post
We can compare and debate the value prop of the i4 vs the Taycan. However, the Taycan buyer is not cross shopping the i4. Probably vice versa.
I disagree, I am looking at both right now. The base Taycan is just not worth it for me, I cant pay that much more for a car that is as slow as the base Taycan even if the feel is a little better.

So that puts me in the 4S, I will still probably go with the 4S for the looks as well as the handling, but everything you get on the i4 for the money is hard to pass up. Yes, I could get more performance for less out of a Model 3P but I hate the interior with a passion and the build quality.

I will still most likely go 4S, but I do want to drive the i4 M50 before I do.
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      01-20-2022, 10:47 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by techwhiz1 View Post
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Originally Posted by GuyOh View Post
But the taycan looks 100x better then the i4
That is very subjective.
Not really.
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      01-20-2022, 11:36 PM   #26
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i4 is one class below size-wise but it weighs as much as Taycan. These 5K lb "sedans" are getting ridiculous. Weighs same as an X5 or a pickup truck.

Isn't the point of an EV to be efficient? Both of these need to lose about 1000lbs, which probably going to be not for another 5-10 years without better batteries.
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      01-21-2022, 01:16 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Haywood View Post
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Originally Posted by techwhiz1 View Post
Hey, I respect that they said it's not the last word in EV salon cars.

I also respect that they said it doesn't feel as agile as the M3/M4 because it's carrying more weight.

They didn't say they hated it.
They also don't state accurately that even a base Taycan with minimal options is over $100k. And good luck trying to get one.
Taycan's are easy to get here. 911's are another story though.
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      01-21-2022, 02:01 AM   #28
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It’s better to match performance when doing a comparison test rather than price, that way you see whether one brand is focusing on certain aspect of it performance rather than as an overall performance package as is the case with the Taycan.

I have the i4M50 on order and my brother has the Taycan CT 4S on order (though at the rate it’s being delayed that could change). Having driven both now I can say that as a drivers car the Porsche wins this hands down, where as the gap between M4 and 911 might be a bit closer it’s not the case here, that said the i4M50 is a more relaxing drive so think of it as more like an M550i than an electric M3 and you are closer to the truth.

Still an awesome car in my eyes.
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      01-21-2022, 05:11 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by JustChris View Post
Autocar have become kings of this. Pitching a £53k RS3 against a £80k M3 XDrive. Bit desperate!
I dont mind this tbh as it gives an idea of where each model is at compared to other supposed lesser or greater models.

Theyre obviously not trying to compare apples to apples, everyone else is doing that.

Theyre basically saying 'So how does your i4 stack up against a better brand?' . Quite well as it happens.
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      01-21-2022, 07:39 AM   #30
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I thought the comparison was interesting.

While I like the Taycan; it doesn't offer the same value proposition as the M50.

I definitely get more than 80% of the Taycan for $40-50k less coin
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      01-21-2022, 12:44 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by 3RDSECTOR View Post
Not really.
Agreed.
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      01-21-2022, 02:36 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by techwhiz1 View Post
I definitely get more than 80% of the Taycan for $40-50k less coin
$40k-$50k is around $80k-$100k pretax payroll money, I am sure experienced EEs like u earn that in a month or two, right?
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      01-21-2022, 04:41 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3RDSECTOR View Post
Not really.
Disagree.
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      01-21-2022, 05:20 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staszek View Post
I disagree, I am looking at both right now. The base Taycan is just not worth it for me, I cant pay that much more for a car that is as slow as the base Taycan even if the feel is a little better.

So that puts me in the 4S, I will still probably go with the 4S for the looks as well as the handling, but everything you get on the i4 for the money is hard to pass up. Yes, I could get more performance for less out of a Model 3P but I hate the interior with a passion and the build quality.

I will still most likely go 4S, but I do want to drive the i4 M50 before I do.
Same boat, My 1st choice was a 4S, but then I went to my Porsche dealer to inquire and 4 others in Florida, all had market-ups at least 10K and my build was a basic $117k one and would be almost 1 - 1.5 years out

Then I read about the i4 M50, looked at the specs, and took a chance.

If the market was right, I would have sprung for the 4S, but as is, the value proposition of the i4 M50 I couldn't pass up.

Will it handle like the 4S? Likely not, but $69k vs $117k build for build, I'm fine with the trade-off. I don't use my current M4cs to its potential and really just drive back/forth to the grocery store thinking I needed a harder-core version of the M4 competition for a daily driver, turns out I don't.
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      01-22-2022, 11:41 AM   #35
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Autocar has the most boring content. That bearded guy has less personality than drying paint.

These cars have no pretentions of competing with one another and I doubt they are cross shopped. Two completely different vehicles at wildly different price points.
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      01-22-2022, 01:40 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
Autocar has the most boring content. That bearded guy has less personality than drying paint.
I'll take him over the likes of DeMuro or Shmee.
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      01-22-2022, 01:43 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
Autocar has the most boring content. That bearded guy has less personality than drying paint.
I do not quite agree.
I like Autocar's style - I just want a car review, not an entertaining video. They have been around for a long time (since 1895, believe it or not), and I used to be their magazine subscriber many years ago. They know about cars (and that's an understatement).

If you want an entertaining video, then yes, you may like CarWow or some other "youtubers" better.
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      01-22-2022, 02:13 PM   #38
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No offense to Matt and Matt but they make some really boring videos.
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      01-22-2022, 04:25 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mani59 View Post
Really pointless. They say, an EV might come along with a longer range and drive faster and be cheaper (like the i4), but unless it drives as 'special' as this Taycan, the Taycan is the winner. Basically, take out range, speed, and price. Just get the best driving ICE car. It's an EV with zero range!

Also, as others have pointed out, the i4 and Taycan compete in different classes.
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      01-22-2022, 04:33 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nosnoop View Post
I do not quite agree.
I like Autocar's style - I just want a car review, not an entertaining video. They have been around for a long time (since 1895, believe it or not), and I used to be their magazine subscriber many years ago. They know about cars (and that's an understatement).

If you want an entertaining video, then yes, you may like CarWow or some other "youtubers" better.
Fair enough, there's something out there for everybody.
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      01-23-2022, 06:02 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Remonster View Post
It's more than a few months of waiting, it's about 6-8 months right now in California. My dad tried to order a Taycan in December and they told him Porsche would build his order around June and deliver it here in July.
This is a US problem actually. POrsche being German car maker, prioritised now Europe, China. The cars Porsche sells in USA are cheapest MSRP, so for Porsche it only makes sense when tehre is a volume factor. However, volume is hard now due to chip shortage, so they target markets with highest price they get, and USA is not it.

You folks got a lot of cars very cheaply for long time due to huge market, but chip shortage made it tricker to justify for car makers to keep bringing cars there and sell at discount to what they go for in Europe. (I mean at what dealers pay etc - in Europe you have also some markets cheaper, say Czech Republic will get a cheaper car compared to something like Latvia). Germany, price is better still. USA - very cheap in comparison.
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      01-26-2022, 08:36 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by AlphaM View Post
Porsche is really audi and audi is sh!t. Period.
LOL, WUT?
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      01-26-2022, 10:27 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest View Post
This is a US problem actually. POrsche being German car maker, prioritised now Europe, China. The cars Porsche sells in USA are cheapest MSRP, so for Porsche it only makes sense when tehre is a volume factor. However, volume is hard now due to chip shortage, so they target markets with highest price they get, and USA is not it.

You folks got a lot of cars very cheaply for long time due to huge market, but chip shortage made it tricker to justify for car makers to keep bringing cars there and sell at discount to what they go for in Europe. (I mean at what dealers pay etc - in Europe you have also some markets cheaper, say Czech Republic will get a cheaper car compared to something like Latvia). Germany, price is better still. USA - very cheap in comparison.
It's not that we were getting a deal; it's calle economy of scale and volume. The US is a huge market and Porsche America or USA can dictate lower prices by sheer volume. BMWNA does the same thing.

Volume dictate prices. Lower volume means higher prices. Now Porsche may be screwing the US because they can get higher prices. That's fine, but given an alternative, iteans that Porsche may lose sales to other companies.
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      01-26-2022, 10:51 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TXSchnee View Post
I am cross shopping the iX, a Taycan 4S Cross Turismo (on waiting list), the Hummer 3X SUV (put down a $100 deposit), and a Rivian R1S. Prices ranging from $80k-$140k. The main issue right now is that there are so few directly comparable, good to drive BEVs out there. So yes, people are cross shopping the Taycan, i4 and probably Tesla.
I am cross shopping a Lucid Air.
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