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      07-29-2019, 02:24 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avantegardestyle View Post
I believe in the protection of the rights of people who don't believe as I do, but that does not mean I believe we should eliminate religion or religious belief from all public places.
you see, Western Civilization was not built on Atheism, nor was it built on on an irreligious concept. it was build on the idea that there is a God and there are moral laws that are necessary for an ordered society.
these laws came from the judaistic concept of morality, carried on by Christianity.

America at its conception had founding fathers who if they were not Christians, at least were Diests. they believe in the existence of God and built their idea of a nation around this notion.

People who want Atheistic nations should not try to change America from its roots but are free to go conquer and found nations according to their ideology.

Go fight wars, go conquer peoples and establish nations according to your idea of what kind of nation you want. if you cant do that, accept the one given to you by its founding fathers

I don't know what an "atheistic nation" is, but I'm not advocating for "changing America from its roots".

I'm advocating for a lack of advertising any theistic beliefs in government buildings and on government land. I feel that is 100% in line with the intents of our FF.

Western civilization was not built on a god belief, either, but I'm done trying to reason with you.

I'm all for messages of belief or non-belief. I'm all against government sponsored messages of the same.

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      07-29-2019, 02:56 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post
I don't know what an "atheistic nation" is, but I'm not advocating for "changing America from its roots".

I'm advocating for a lack of advertising any theistic beliefs in government buildings and on government land. I feel that is 100% in line with the intents of our FF.

Western civilization was not built on a god belief, either, but I'm done trying to reason with you.

I'm all for messages of belief or non-belief. I'm all against government sponsored messages of the same.


can you explain your position here. unless its not the same western civilization you and I are speaking about.


From Heracletus, to Hesoid to Homer, to the Pythagoreans to Moses to Jesus Christ to Constantine, to Augustine, Luther, Descartes, Rousseau, Luther, Nietzsche, or whomever you want to name that have contributed to the development of Western Civilization, they all grappled with Morality and the Question of God

Neitzsche the most honest and brilliant of Atheists admitted in his parable of the madman that to remove God from the center of society is to create a society that had nothing to tie it together, and that God would need to be replaced by something.
Marx invented the principles of communism and a godless society and it was applied to devastating consequences.

you can cry for what you want, but a wise man I knew once said "you might get what you want, but not like what you get"
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      07-29-2019, 04:14 PM   #47
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God (TM) with a capital "G" is a trademark of Judeo-Christian religion, all rights reserved. Per the Holy Bible (TM), God's image must not be drawn or reproduced in any way, and also don't forget that worshipping icons is prohibited.

god with a lower-case "g" is a descriptor for any monotheistic or polytheistic deity, such as Moloch, Zeus, Allah, Jehovah, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and of course the nameless/faceless Judeo-Christian God (TM).

Deity is any imaginary friend created by mankind, to explain anything that their limited knowledge of the universe, science, nature, etc could not comprehend at the time.

"In God (TM) we trust" (with a capital "G") certainly seems to be pushing one brand of deity over all others, hence needing to be banned along with Roy Moore's 10 commandments monuments.....
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      07-29-2019, 04:46 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vreihen16 View Post
God (TM) with a capital "G" is a trademark of Judeo-Christian religion, all rights reserved. Per the Holy Bible (TM), God's image must not be drawn or reproduced in any way, and also don't forget that worshipping icons is prohibited.

god with a lower-case "g" is a descriptor for any monotheistic or polytheistic deity, such as Moloch, Zeus, Allah, Jehovah, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and of course the nameless/faceless Judeo-Christian God (TM).

Deity is any imaginary friend created by mankind, to explain anything that their limited knowledge of the universe, science, nature, etc could not comprehend at the time.

"In God (TM) we trust" (with a capital "G") certainly seems to be pushing one brand of deity over all others, hence needing to be banned along with Roy Moore's 10 commandments monuments.....
What if it's in all caps with the entire phrase.
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      07-29-2019, 04:47 PM   #49
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^ I had to go look at some currency. On the currency, it's all caps.
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      07-29-2019, 04:53 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vreihen16 View Post
G
Deity is any imaginary friend created by mankind, to explain anything that their limited knowledge of the universe, science, nature, etc could not comprehend at the time.
what Rubbish you speak. come with an original idea you thought of yourself.

Lets take the bibles conception of God.

God is separate and apart from nature, an immaterial spirit, whether this is true or not is not the issue. what matters is that the very conception of God as postulated in the scriptures has nothing to do with a desire to explain anything because the very scriptures make it clear that God is NOT a part of Nature or the created order
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      07-29-2019, 05:18 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post
And now you're apparently conflating writing that phrase in Arabic to it being linked to a specific religion. It is just as non-denominational in any language on the planet.
I don't get what you are saying. God is God period..No difference between The God of Abraham or Muhammad
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      07-29-2019, 05:26 PM   #52
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I guess the ultimate question is...


Why does anyone care?


If the word God is on our money? Who gives a shit. If they take it off the money? Who gives a shit.

Surely there are other things that folks can be doing other than getting bent out of shape about this?
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      07-29-2019, 07:47 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avantegardestyle View Post
can you explain your position here. unless its not the same western civilization you and I are speaking about.


From Heracletus, to Hesoid to Homer, to the Pythagoreans to Moses to Jesus Christ to Constantine, to Augustine, Luther, Descartes, Rousseau, Luther, Nietzsche, or whomever you want to name that have contributed to the development of Western Civilization, they all grappled with Morality and the Question of God

Neitzsche the most honest and brilliant of Atheists admitted in his parable of the madman that to remove God from the center of society is to create a society that had nothing to tie it together, and that God would need to be replaced by something.
Marx invented the principles of communism and a godless society and it was applied to devastating consequences.

you can cry for what you want, but a wise man I knew once said "you might get what you want, but not like what you get"
What tenets of "Western Civilization", specifically, either require a god belief or can trace their origin to a belief in deities? Not people who had ideas, who also happened to believe in God/gods, mind you.
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      07-29-2019, 07:48 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer456 View Post
What if it's in all caps with the entire phrase.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
^ I had to go look at some currency. On the currency, it's all caps.
If it is all caps, then net.etiquette says that the writer is shouting and you can assume it refers to the Judeo-Christian brand of deity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Why does anyone care?

If the word God is on our money? Who gives a shit. If they take it off the money? Who gives a shit.
Because some people don't trust in God (TM)! Why does the thing that let 9/11 kill my friends (and almost my brother!) in the WTC deserve my trust? Why can't it stop wars, prevent the 737 Max from crashing twice, or cure famine? Nope, not getting any trust from moi.....
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      07-29-2019, 07:50 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post
What tenets of "Western Civilization", specifically, either require a god belief or can trace their origin to a belief in deities? Not people who had ideas, who also happened to believe in God/gods, mind you.
Justice and the rule of law.
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      07-29-2019, 07:51 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by adc100 View Post
I don't get what you are saying. God is God period..No difference between The God of Abraham or Muhammad
Sorry, I can't be any more clear than I have been.

Yes, the god of Abraham and Muhammad are one and the same. I've been saying that since my first post in this thread.

You seemed to take the stance that "In God We Trust" was officially sanctioned by our government, but that "In Allah We Trust" wouldn't be. I disagreed with that position.

If that's NOT what you've been intending to communicate, then there's nothing further we need to try to sort out.
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      07-29-2019, 08:05 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avantegardestyle View Post
Justice and the rule of law.
And that requires God/gods in what way?

Further, those notions are not unique to "Western Civilization".
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      07-29-2019, 08:18 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vreihen16 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer456 View Post
What if it's in all caps with the entire phrase.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
^ I had to go look at some currency. On the currency, it's all caps.
If it is all caps, then net.etiquette says that the writer is shouting and you can assume it refers to the Judeo-Christian brand of deity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Why does anyone care?

If the word God is on our money? Who gives a shit. If they take it off the money? Who gives a shit.
Because some people don't trust in God (TM)! Why does the thing that let 9/11 kill my friends (and almost my brother!) in the WTC deserve my trust? Why can't it stop wars, prevent the 737 Max from crashing twice, or cure famine? Nope, not getting any trust from moi.....
Anything bad that happens is satan's fault. God allows him to test us and if we pass we go to heaven. Seems cruel but Adam sinned so we carry the burden. Though some folks actually do deserve to go to hell. And even good people aren't 100 percent perfect which you have to be to go to heaven and leave this cruel world. Also God wants us to convert as many atheists as possible before we leave this earth so that's why we don't just go now.
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      07-29-2019, 09:22 PM   #59
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Don't bother trying to convert me. I've been warned by a horde of Jerry Falwell followers that I would burn in hell for not letting them illegally jump a crowd control barrier to disrupt an event that they were bussed in to protest, so my soul is already as good as toast. I don't fear any god, just its crazy followers.

To paraphrase one of the 20th century's greatest philosophers (George Carlin) - When I get to the pearly gates, St. Peter and I are going to have a whole lot more important stuff to discuss than my diet on lent.....
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      07-30-2019, 08:48 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avantegardestyle View Post
I will become concerned when religious doctrine is being taught in schools, or when church services are being held. until then, much ado...…..
They actually hold church serves in public schools here. True story (just not during school hours).
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      07-30-2019, 09:01 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avantegardestyle View Post
Why make the point and miss it at the same time?
of course it would mean the same thing spoken or written in another language. except you ignore the fact that all official US documents are written in English and the united states official language is English.

when you can bring me an official US dollar with German, Italian or Arabic wording on it then we can talk.
the Unites States may be welcoming to All people but its NOT a free for all country.
How about Latin?

edit: I should also mention that I think that RunSilent hit it on the head right away. People in this country and complaining about everything because they don't have any real issues they have to worry about. It is tiresome.
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Last edited by Hawkeye; 07-30-2019 at 09:09 AM..
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