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      10-02-2020, 04:29 AM   #1
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Honda to leave F1 at end of 2021 season

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/54383259

So what do you guys think? Seems like bad news for Max right?
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      10-02-2020, 04:42 AM   #2
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Good news for Renault.
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      10-02-2020, 04:42 AM   #3
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Not necessarily.

Imagine a RB with a Merc powerplant.

Anyway, they will most probably end up with Renault again, and that is not a bad thing. Mclaren and Renault have not exactly been slow this year.
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      10-02-2020, 09:17 AM   #4
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Their chances of beating a manufacturer that runs their own factory team using one of their engines is close to zero. They had a chance with Honda as Honda didn't have a factory team. MB, Ferrari, Renault - factory teams virtually always do better than the teams they supply. If MB were to supply them an engine (I think highly unlikely), it would almost guarantee them that they would be the 2nd best team and almost guarantee them they will never be the best.

As for Honda, I think the money they spend on F1 was impossible to justify and it was strictly about trying to spend their money and resources in a way to increase sales. How many additional cars sales did their F1 program really generate? Can anyone here honestly say they know someone that was swayed to buy a Honda because of their F1 team?

Trying to justify the money based on technology transfer from F1 to daily drivers is impossible.
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      10-02-2020, 09:20 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
Their chances of beating a manufacturer that runs their own factory team using one of their engines is close to zero. They had a chance with Honda as Honda didn't have a factory team. MB, Ferrari, Renault - factory teams virtually always do better than the teams they supply. If MB were to supply them an engine (I think highly unlikely), it would almost guarantee them that they would be the 2nd best team and almost guarantee them they will never be the best.

As for Honda, I think the money they spend on F1 was impossible to justify and it was strictly about trying to spend their money and resources in a way to increase sales. How many additional cars sales did their F1 program really generate? Can anyone here honestly say they know someone that was swayed to buy a Honda because of their F1 team?

Trying to justify the money based on technology transfer from F1 to daily drivers is impossible.
I was swayed to Honda because of the G8x
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      10-02-2020, 10:39 AM   #6
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McLaren happy with their decision even more now.
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      10-02-2020, 03:50 PM   #7
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seems like old couple Renault and Red Bull will try again..

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      10-02-2020, 06:53 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
Their chances of beating a manufacturer that runs their own factory team using one of their engines is close to zero. They had a chance with Honda as Honda didn't have a factory team. MB, Ferrari, Renault - factory teams virtually always do better than the teams they supply. If MB were to supply them an engine (I think highly unlikely), it would almost guarantee them that they would be the 2nd best team and almost guarantee them they will never be the best.
This just isn't true. RB already was a Renault customer team and beat Renault on pure merit in 2016, 2017, and 2018.

Redbull would easily become the fastest Ferrari powered team if they were to take that engine, but no one wants to touch it with a 10 foot pole.

In fact, Ferrari is barely the fastest Ferrari powered team now. Some of that may be due to the fact that they made a car with a loose rear end that favors Charles' driving style over Seb's, but their car is still awful this year.

Mercedes is unlikely to agree to supply Redbull because it would present a threat (however slight) to their dominance.

But Renault doesn't have a choice under the sporting regulations. As the engine manufacturer supplying the fewest teams, they are required to supply Redbull if Redbull asks them to.
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      10-02-2020, 07:30 PM   #9
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Interestingly, Honda appears ready to announce tomorrow it will continue to supply engines to the IndyCar League. They and Chevrolet will commit to a multiyear engine program that includes the (delayed till 2023) 2.4L twin turbo hybrid power unit.
https://racer.com/2020/10/02/indycar...-announcement/
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      10-02-2020, 08:31 PM   #10
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They're probably tired of hearing max bitch and moan all the time.
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      10-03-2020, 02:39 AM   #11
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Merc have already said in the past that they won't supply Red Bull with engines.
I'd be surprised if Renault would want to supply engines to Red Bull again as long as they have a factory team and were dumped by RB for Honda.
But critically the way Verstappen constantly whined about the Renault power plant makes it unlikely that Renault would supply RB as long as he is there.
You'd think Horner would have been smart enough to have instructed Verstappen to keep his whining about Renault off the (open) team radio.
Honda won't currently supply engines to any race team that Alonso wants to drive for, due his endless whining about the Honda engine while he was at McLaren.
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      10-03-2020, 07:56 AM   #12
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+1 tot he last 2 posts. When that adolescent runs out of talent to pass, it automatically becomes the PUís fault. Such a little bitch sometimes.
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      10-03-2020, 08:21 AM   #13
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      10-03-2020, 09:35 AM   #14
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      10-03-2020, 09:37 AM   #15
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First time I've scrolled to the bottom of the main forum page to find racing discussion! I know the Volkswagen/Porsche to F1 rumors have been around for a while but is this the in for them?
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      10-03-2020, 09:41 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants View Post
I'd be surprised if Renault would want to supply engines to Red Bull again as long as they have a factory team and were dumped by RB for Honda.
But critically the way Verstappen constantly whined about the Renault power plant makes it unlikely that Renault would supply RB as long as he is there.
The only problem for Renault is they will be forced supply engines to Red Bull under the current rules if RB canít sign with Merc, Ferrari or someone else.
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      10-03-2020, 09:52 AM   #17
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I just picked one up because of this thread
Still have the S too as an F1 inspired version I guess. Think it was the last
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      10-03-2020, 09:57 AM   #18
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First time I've scrolled to the bottom of the main forum page to find racing discussion! I know the Volkswagen/Porsche to F1 rumors have been around for a while but is this the in for them?
Mate . # 230 => https://www.m3post.com/forums/showth...?p=26756887#po
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      10-03-2020, 10:13 AM   #19
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I don't see any financial sense in VW jumping in on this. Car sales have been projected to slump over the next 5-6 years, and COVID strained everyone's budgets this year. There is too little to gain. I project no entry into F1. I can also see Merc leaving if the sales volumes drop as projected.
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      10-03-2020, 12:27 PM   #20
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The same fuel flow winter rule changes that affected Ferraris engine performance have also taken the edge off Honda's PU.
This may have been a deciding factor along with the ever reducing attraction of being involved in an ICE race series....with electric street car development being at the forefront of R&D expenditure.
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      10-03-2020, 06:19 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants View Post
Merc have already said in the past that they won't supply Red Bull with engines.
I'd be surprised if Renault would want to supply engines to Red Bull again as long as they have a factory team and were dumped by RB for Honda.
But critically the way Verstappen constantly whined about the Renault power plant makes it unlikely that Renault would supply RB as long as he is there.
You'd think Horner would have been smart enough to have instructed Verstappen to keep his whining about Renault off the (open) team radio.
Honda won't currently supply engines to any race team that Alonso wants to drive for, due his endless whining about the Honda engine while he was at McLaren.
The thing is, Renault doesn't have a choice in the matter. Because they are the engine manufacturer who supplies the fewest teams (2 for them currently and down to 1 when Mclaren gets Mercedes power, 3 for Merc and 3 for Ferrari), they are required to provide engines to any team that needs them and does not have an alternative under Article 9 of the FIA sporting regs.
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      10-04-2020, 05:05 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalAcacian View Post
The thing is, Renault doesn't have a choice in the matter. Because they are the engine manufacturer who supplies the fewest teams (2 for them currently and down to 1 when Mclaren gets Mercedes power, 3 for Merc and 3 for Ferrari), they are required to provide engines to any team that needs them and does not have an alternative under Article 9 of the FIA sporting regs.
Thats true...but while Renault are apparently prepared to comply with the regs neither they or Red Bull (and AlphaTauri) are at all enthusiastic about it.
What other choice is there?
Aston Martin threatened a couple of years ago to manufacturer an F1 engine but that now seems unlikely to ever happen.

Last edited by SenorFunkyPants; 10-04-2020 at 05:25 AM..
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