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      12-24-2018, 09:27 PM   #353
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Originally Posted by adc100 View Post
Sorry your facts are wrong. They oppose it bc their (necessary) left wing base totally hates it. As you recall Schumer shut down the Government this year. Americans will hardly notice government the small part of government that is shut down. Not a big deal.

but I will continue after Christmas. Merry Christmas!!!
Which facts are wrong? The first reason I gave was because their constituents oppose it.

We will notice it. Since my wife is in the Coast Guard (DHS), she won't be getting paid on January 1st. Neither will any of those Coasties out there enforcing customs and border security laws and saving lives. You think it doesn't impact you, so to hell all those families working without pay while the shutdown is on, right? Especially all those young enlisted families who live paycheck to paycheck.

Shutdowns also cost taxpayers millions, and sometimes billions of dollars. It's estimated the 2013 shutdown cost around $23 billion. This one has probably already cost the economy billions of dollars because of the uncertainty and chaos, and has the potential to be significantly worse. All because some little baby didn't get his wall money.

Also, I don't agree that the last shutdown rests entirely on Schumer's shoulders, but even if it does, what difference does that make? Playing chicken with peoples lives isn't ok for any political party. At least the shutdown didn't involve DOD this time.

Merry Xmas to you too, and I hope you and yours receive your paychecks as scheduled.
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      12-24-2018, 09:35 PM   #354
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Originally Posted by cjb762 View Post
...some polls show the majority of Americans (all Americans - dem and repub) are opposed to the building of more walls.
Credit given for applying the "some polls" qualifier, but I say all the time "the only polls that really matter are the legally-binding ones (i.e.: elections)." Trump won the election saying loud and clear he was building a wall.


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Second, as a separate, independent, and equal branch of government, they are taking a stand against trump....
I agree there's a major political motivations in the opposition. Not the first time this has happened, but the severity sure seems unprecedented.


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Originally Posted by cjb762 View Post
I despise trump and his non-stop imbecilic and juvenile behavior.
One of my tenants on Trump's political career, is that lots of the small "r" resistance from both sides of the isle is motivated more from not caring for his style/personality, than necessarily his policies.



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He probably could have gotten the dems to vote for the money if he had gone about it the right way
Come on! You can't really believe that. :

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The threat of a government shut down should never be used as a tool for political gain - by any party or branch.
THAT is exactly why you should be against the 'blame every shutdown on the Republicans' thing we have in American politics. If I were an elected Democrat I too would be motivated to keep going back to that well if Republicans always got the blame! What political motivation do Democrats have for preventing a shutdown of Republicans always get blamed for it?
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      12-24-2018, 09:55 PM   #355
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Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Credit given for applying the "some polls" qualifier, but I say all the time that the only polls that really matter are the legally-binding ones (I.e.: elections). Trump won the election saying loud and clear he was building a wall.
I thought he won it by saying loud and clear that he wasn't hillary clinton... Also, how can you have any faith in polls with all the rampant voter fraud?


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Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
One of my tenants is that lots of the small "r" resistance form both sides of the isle is motivated more from not caring for Trump's style/personality than necessarily his policies.

Oh, a lot of his policies are asinine also - especially when it comes to science, taxes, conservation, and international relations.


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Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Come on! You can't really believe that. :
Do I believe that trump has the ability to act rationally and negotiate within a democratic framework? No. Do I believe that a republican president could have gotten the $5 billion for a wall? Yes. There are already hundreds of miles of walls and fences along the border thanks to bi-partisan bills. If a normal human being type had made their case rationally with facts, negotiation, and compromise rather than threats, tantrums, and fear mongering, I'm certain that the money could have been appropriated.

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Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
THAT is exactly why you should be against the 'blame every shutdown on the Republicans' thing we have in American politics. If I were an elected Democrat I too would be motivated to keep going back to that well if Republicans always got the blame!
I don't blame every shutdown on the republicans. This one is 110% squarely on trump though. You have to admit - the republicans are making it pretty easy for dems to blame them recently though....
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      12-26-2018, 08:02 AM   #356
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      12-26-2018, 10:44 AM   #357
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Former ICE chief Tom Homan rips Nancy Pelosi for doubting border wall works

Former acting ICE Director Tom Homan on Wednesday blasted House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi for calling a border wall ineffective and accusing President Trump of "fear mongering" with the illegal immigration issue.

"Every place a wall or barrier has been built, it has resulted in decreased illegal immigration, decreased drug smuggling. One hundred percent of the time, it has proven effective," Mr. Homan said...

"Look at the rest of the data on the border, where arrests of MS-13 [gang] this year are up 118 percent, the seizures of guns — for God's sake — are up almost 200 percent. There's your data. Look at it. You can see why we need a wall," he said.

Mrs. Pelosi told USA Today that Mr. Trump was using the wall to "fear monger."

"He talked about terrorists coming in over that particular border, which wasn't so. He talked about people bringing in diseases and all the rest of that, which wasn't so," said Mrs. Pelosi... "He's using scare tactics that are not evidence-based, and it's wrong."

"Allow me to educate Mrs. Pelosi," he said. "As far as crime coming across the border, ICE arrested 138,000 criminals last year. These are people who entered the country illegally and committed crimes against the people of this country."

Last year, ICE arrested illegal immigrants in more than 2,000 homicides cases, more than 11,000 weapon violations and almost 12,000 sexual assaults, Mr. Homan said.

U.S. immigration officials routinely deal with contagious diseases, including tuberculosis, measles and chickenpox, he said.


https://m.washingtontimes.com
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      12-27-2018, 07:19 AM   #358
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      12-27-2018, 08:42 AM   #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Former ICE chief Tom Homan rips Nancy Pelosi for doubting border wall works

Former acting ICE Director Tom Homan on Wednesday blasted House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi for calling a border wall ineffective and accusing President Trump of "fear mongering" with the illegal immigration issue.

"Every place a wall or barrier has been built, it has resulted in decreased illegal immigration, decreased drug smuggling. One hundred percent of the time, it has proven effective," Mr. Homan said...

"Look at the rest of the data on the border, where arrests of MS-13 [gang] this year are up 118 percent, the seizures of guns for God's sake are up almost 200 percent. There's your data. Look at it. You can see why we need a wall," he said.

Mrs. Pelosi told USA Today that Mr. Trump was using the wall to "fear monger."

"He talked about terrorists coming in over that particular border, which wasn't so. He talked about people bringing in diseases and all the rest of that, which wasn't so," said Mrs. Pelosi... "He's using scare tactics that are not evidence-based, and it's wrong."

"Allow me to educate Mrs. Pelosi," he said. "As far as crime coming across the border, ICE arrested 138,000 criminals last year. These are people who entered the country illegally and committed crimes against the people of this country."

Last year, ICE arrested illegal immigrants in more than 2,000 homicides cases, more than 11,000 weapon violations and almost 12,000 sexual assaults, Mr. Homan said.

U.S. immigration officials routinely deal with contagious diseases, including tuberculosis, measles and chickenpox, he said.


https://m.washingtontimes.com
Can we close the thread, please.
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      12-27-2018, 04:12 PM   #360
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      01-14-2019, 02:56 AM   #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lsturbointeg View Post
the fact that he said Mexico will pay for it during his campaign but now wants us to pay for it
We paid for Israel's wall via foreign aid so why shouldn't we pay for our own

In all reality though the wall cost should be split 50/50 between two neighbors. Our house had 3 neighbors when we moved in back in 1979 and when we moved in we had no walls on all 3 sides. All neighbors agreed to split the cost of the wall on their side 50/50. We had great neighbors, as soon as we said we need walls every neighbor said yes, we will split it 50/50 with you. No one wants their neighbor's dogs running into their own yards and pooping in their backyards. The bad side of it though was if they had dogs and you did not then you ended up with all the rodents sitting in your yard instead of theirs.
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      01-14-2019, 04:00 AM   #362
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Originally Posted by stylinexpat View Post
We paid for Israel's wall via foreign aid so why shouldn't we pay for our own

In all reality though the wall cost should be split 50/50 between two neighbors. Our house had 3 neighbors when we moved in back in 1979 and when we moved in we had no walls on all 3 sides. All neighbors agreed to split the cost of the wall on their side 50/50. We had great neighbors, as soon as we said we need walls every neighbor said yes, we will split it 50/50 with you. No one wants their neighbor's dogs running into their own yards and pooping in their backyards. The bad side of it though was if they had dogs and you did not then you ended up with all the rodents sitting in your yard instead of theirs.
So... explain how this is analogous to this wall. What reason does Mexico have to pay for 50% of the wall?
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      01-14-2019, 08:47 AM   #363
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      01-14-2019, 09:46 AM   #364
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I'm watching this for any news reports of people saying they didn't get their money. I have a feeling that this is going to be entertaining.
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