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      07-02-2018, 11:46 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
Forgive, maybe you are not yet aware, but from Finland, as you put it "your shit" you already got.

https://www.nord-stream2.com/ru/pdf/document/156/

and

https://www.nord-stream2.com/ru/pdf/document/157/
written in jibberish code. english links please
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      07-02-2018, 11:47 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by The Wind Breezes View Post
Lol as if politics works even close to that way in the 21st century. Nobody with half a brain believes that, so I conclude you're being purposely disingenuous.
Of course, I little purposely disingenuous, but why does not anyone want to directly answer my question - US has something to do with it??
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      07-02-2018, 11:47 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
Forgive, maybe you are not yet aware, but from Finland, as you put it "your shit" you already got.

https://www.nord-stream2.com/ru/pdf/document/156/

and

https://www.nord-stream2.com/ru/pdf/document/157/
Yeah, I'm with Watchie in this one.
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      07-02-2018, 11:55 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lups View Post
as in Finland. before you guys get your shit together
Forgive, maybe you are not yet aware, but from Finland, as you put it "your shit" you already got.

https://www.nord-stream2.com/ru/pdf/document/156/

and

https://www.nord-stream2.com/ru/pdf/document/157/
I think we all have a real fear of being infected with some sort of virus if we touch any links related to Russia.
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      07-02-2018, 12:00 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
I think we all have a real fear of being infected with some sort of virus if we touch any links related to Russia.
i clicked them and now i have a strange urge to chug vodka and do something crazy while naked
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      07-02-2018, 12:12 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy View Post
i clicked them and now i have a strange urge to chug vodka and do something crazy while naked
So...what's different?
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      07-02-2018, 12:13 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
So...what's different?
usually i chug tequila when im naked
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      07-02-2018, 12:28 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy View Post
usually i chug tequila when im naked
I thought you might do the Matthew McConaughey thing: Get stoned, get naked, play bongos.

Or the Putin thing: Shot of Vodka, strangle a polar bear. With your toes.
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      07-02-2018, 12:59 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
As you know, Russia, together with Europe, is starting the construction of an offshore natural gas pipeline from Russian Federation to Germany - Nord Stream 2.
This is the second phase of gas pipeline, project which would include two additional lines to increase the overall annual capacity up to 110 billion cubic metres.


The US wants to block this construction and say they will impose sanctions on companies participating in the project, but German side says this will not affect the building of a gas pipeline.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1JP1CX
It would seem - where is Europe and where is the US and what does the US have to the gas pipeline to Europe?
Do you think the United States has a grateful goal? They want to explain to stupid Europe that she does not need this gas pipeline, or they have some other purpose?

Fair question. Lets look at a few facts:

Fact 1: Russian energy minister Novak has said that politics should not enter into these discussions about planned Russian infrastructure expansion.

Fact 2: Russia plans to double their annual natural gas output to over 100 billion cubic meters per year potentially flooding the EU market and making it difficult for domestic EU competition.

Fact 3: Russia has routinely frozen natural gas deliveries to parts of Europe.

Fact 4: Russia has a history of punishing their own territories and states with excessive rates, and, not to mention, deadly military action.

Fact 5: With numerous violations of international law, Russia annexed Crimea from the Ukraine and restricted flow of NG to the region, murdered innocent civilians with their military interference in the Crimea, and, among other things, meddled in the US elections of 2016 — (all of which Russia has denied).

Opinion: Facts 1: typical Russian deflection statement, naive too;

Opinion: Facts 2 through 5: Russian political interference, divisiveness , oppression and coercion on sovereign nations, particularly those in the eastern sector.

Is it surprising the west is imposing economic sanctions by invoking provisions of CAATSA?

Is it any wonder why countries don’t view Russia as a reliable nation to deal with?

Last edited by Sea-Tac; 07-02-2018 at 01:27 PM.
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      07-02-2018, 01:06 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
As you know, Russia, together with Europe, is starting the construction of an offshore natural gas pipeline from Russian Federation to Germany - Nord Stream 2.
This is the second phase of gas pipeline, project which would include two additional lines to increase the overall annual capacity up to 110 billion cubic metres.

)
Speaking of Crimea, I see Kaliningrad (Königsberg) on your map. That territory was taken over in 1945. Isn't it time to return it to Poland, or Germany. They have a MUCH better historical claim on it than Russia has on Crimea.
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      07-02-2018, 01:10 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Sea-Tac View Post
Fair question. Lets look at a few facts:

Fact 1: Russian energy minister Novak has said that politics should not enter into these discussions about planned Russian infrastructure expansion.

Fact 2: Russia plans to double their annual natural gas output to over 100 billion cubic meters per year.

Fact 3: Russia has routinely frozen natural gas deliveries to parts of Europe.

Fact 4: Russia has a history of punishing their own territories and states with excessive rates, and, not to mention deadly military action.

Fact 5: With numerous violations of international law, Russia annexed Crimea from the Ukraine and restricted flow of NG to the region, murdered innocent civilians with their military interference in the Crimea, and, among other things, meddled in the US elections of 2016 — (all of which Russia has denied).

Opinion: Facts 1: typical Russian deflection statement, naive too;

Opinion: Facts 2 through 5: Russian political interference, divisiveness , oppression and coercion on sovereign nations, particularly those in the eastern sector.

Is it surprising the west is imposing economic sanctions by invoking provisions of CAATSA?

Is it any wonder why countries don’t view Russia as a reliable nation to deal with?
Please hold. I'll be hitting the appreciate button for this one all night just to make sure you know how much I appreciate your post.

Now please write it to a form that Google translate prefers.
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You're still a little new here, so I'll let you in on a little secret. Whenever Lups types gibberish, this is an opportunity for you to imagine it to be whatever you'd like it to be.
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Originally Posted by Delta0311 View Post
How would you know this? Did mommy catch you jerking off to some Big Foot porn ?
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      07-02-2018, 01:34 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Lups View Post
Please hold. I'll be hitting the appreciate button for this one all night just to make sure you know how much I appreciate your post.

Now please write it to a form that Google translate prefers.
Thanks. Its really pretty simple. And something else. It isn't just the Trump administration in opposition. Obama's administration was in opposition too (my God, a commonality of purpose) and if my memory serves me well, there was some serious talk in GW's admin as well about the early stages of the Russian pipeline endeavor...not certain though.
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      07-02-2018, 01:39 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by TheWatchGuy View Post
written in jibberish code. english links please
I cited these links for Lups, they are in Finnish, it's strange that he also does not see, well, at least the Russian virus saw
Well, here in English:
https://www.nord-stream2.com/en/pdf/document/100/
or by looking at the documents on the right by the link
https://www.nord-stream2.com/permitt...tting-process/
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      07-02-2018, 01:47 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Sea-Tac View Post
Thanks. Its really pretty simple. And something else. It isn't just the Trump administration in opposition. Obama's administration was in opposition too (my God, a commonality of purpose) and if my memory serves me well, there was some serious talk in GW's admin as well about the early stages of the Russian pipeline endeavor...not certain though.
I spent about ten years screaming that that gas might be cheap and yeah, a pipeline is nice but if Germany shuts down their nuclear plants, they might want a better source for energy than Russia.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schröder

No liver can take as many pints I've endured talking about that dude.

Europe has a huge energy problem. That's a given. Now, the coalition Putin/ Trump thinks that makes us weak, but the German plants will be up and running in hours if needed, and we can do with only a little. Russia forgets that they've won every time cuz they have winters but these days the Europe works together, talks no shit about China, and these days we have winter coats.
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You're still a little new here, so I'll let you in on a little secret. Whenever Lups types gibberish, this is an opportunity for you to imagine it to be whatever you'd like it to be.
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How would you know this? Did mommy catch you jerking off to some Big Foot porn ?
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      07-02-2018, 02:00 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
I cited these links for Lups, they are in Finnish, it's strange that he also does not see, well, at least the Russian virus saw
Well, here in English:
https://www.nord-stream2.com/en/pdf/document/100/
or by looking at the documents on the right by the link
https://www.nord-stream2.com/permitt...tting-process/
well, hes a she so...
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      07-02-2018, 02:02 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Sea-Tac View Post
Fair question. Lets look at a few facts:

Fact 1: Russian energy minister Novak has said that politics should not enter into these discussions about planned Russian infrastructure expansion.

Fact 2: Russia plans to double their annual natural gas output to over 100 billion cubic meters per year potentially flooding the EU market and making it difficult for domestic EU competition.

Fact 3: Russia has routinely frozen natural gas deliveries to parts of Europe.

Fact 4: Russia has a history of punishing their own territories and states with excessive rates, and, not to mention, deadly military action.

Fact 5: With numerous violations of international law, Russia annexed Crimea from the Ukraine and restricted flow of NG to the region, murdered innocent civilians with their military interference in the Crimea, and, among other things, meddled in the US elections of 2016 — (all of which Russia has denied).

Opinion: Facts 1: typical Russian deflection statement, naive too;

Opinion: Facts 2 through 5: Russian political interference, divisiveness , oppression and coercion on sovereign nations, particularly those in the eastern sector.

Is it surprising the west is imposing economic sanctions by invoking provisions of CAATSA?

Is it any wonder why countries don’t view Russia as a reliable nation to deal with?
I am grateful to you for such a detailed argumentation in this discussion, but now I'm not trying to discuss the entire history of Russia for the past 100 years, I never received an answer to the question - what does the US have to do with it?
Once again - Russia and Germany (mostly) are building a gas pipeline from Russia to Germany. Do you think Germany is stupid? Germany itself can not solve this issue (without the US)?


PS ...no, according to your arguments - you yourself started )))
According to your fact 5, please specify:
How many civilians did Russia kill with the bloody annexation of the Crimea? Well, maybe I do not know something, you probably have accurate data, maybe even a list of these unhappy civilians? At the same time please specify how many years the heroic defense of the Crimea lasted, after which it was evidently Crimea and was captured by artful Russian troops?
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      07-02-2018, 02:07 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Lups View Post
I spent about ten years screaming that that gas might be cheap and yeah, a pipeline is nice but if Germany shuts down their nuclear plants, they might want a better source for energy than Russia.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schröder

No liver can take as many pints I've endured talking about that dude.

E.
I liked this guy a lot better. But I get the names mixed up.
Image result for schrodinger's cat
Schrödinger's cat is a thought experiment, sometimes described as a paradox, devised by Austrian physicist Erwin Schrödinger in 1935. It illustrates what he saw as the problem of the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum mechanics applied to everyday objects.
Schrödinger's cat - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schrödinger%27s_cat
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      07-02-2018, 02:10 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
How many civilians did Russia kill with the bloody annexation of the Crimea? Well, maybe I do not know something, you probably have accurate data, maybe even a list of these unhappy civilians? At the same time please specify how many years the heroic defense of the Crimea lasted, after which it was evidently Crimea and was captured by artful Russian troops?
NUMBER UNKNOWN. and you mean the forced, armed annexation of Crimea.

What about the treaty Russia signed, guaranteeing there would be no hostility toward Ukraine? When did Russia announce the abrogation of said treaty?

Outsiders aren't really allowed in Crimea right now.
10k+ killed in Ukraine so far.
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      07-02-2018, 02:15 PM   #41
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Sorry, I'll answer later, Japan / Belgium is already 2-0 - I'm shocked!
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      07-02-2018, 02:15 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
I cited these links for Lups, they are in Finnish, it's strange that he also does not see, well, at least the Russian virus saw
Well, here in English:
https://www.nord-stream2.com/en/pdf/document/100/
or by looking at the documents on the right by the link
https://www.nord-stream2.com/permitt...tting-process/
Dude, if you could please explain how that is in any way a counter argument to my post?

My Finnish is a bit Rusty, but according to that one can build it. It's not stating we should.
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How would you know this? Did mommy catch you jerking off to some Big Foot porn ?
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      07-02-2018, 03:08 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Ivan Ivanov View Post
I am grateful to you for such a detailed argumentation in this discussion, but now I'm not trying to discuss the entire history of Russia for the past 100 years, I never received an answer to the question - what does the US have to do with it?
Once again - Russia and Germany (mostly) are building a gas pipeline from Russia to Germany. Do you think Germany is stupid? Germany itself can not solve this issue (without the US)?


PS ...no, according to your arguments - you yourself started )))
According to your fact 5, please specify:
How many civilians did Russia kill with the bloody annexation of the Crimea? Well, maybe I do not know something, you probably have accurate data, maybe even a list of these unhappy civilians? At the same time please specify how many years the heroic defense of the Crimea lasted, after which it was evidently Crimea and was captured by artful Russian troops?
Hello Ivan...

There is no argument. I stated facts. Facts are a known, verifiable and quantifiable thing that can be proven by independent evidence.

236 civilians died in conflict related violence since Russia caused the Crimean conflict between 2014 and 2016. As of 2016 the overall death total in the conflict was 9160 according to the United Nations.

I don't have a list of the dead civilians. If you contact the International Court of Justice in The Hague, NL, names are recorded there. They do this as the necessary preliminary work for evidentiary purposes to be used against those tried criminally on the world stage.

Certainly, dead civilians are no longer unhappy civilians, though I would think they would rather be unhappy than dead. I would think those that are unhappy are their loved ones, especially, any children they left behind.

I know of no such thing of a "heroic" defense of the Crimea.
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      07-02-2018, 03:45 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Sea-Tac View Post
I stated facts.

236 civilians died in conflict related violence since Russia caused the Crimean conflict between 2014 and 2016. As of 2016 the overall death total in the conflict was 9160 according to the United Nations.
When a person speaks so loudly that he stated facts, he usually applies and proofs.
You did not put any proofs, I wonder why? Probably you were just shy about leading irrefutable facts?
I'm attaching your proof, which you somehow lost, here it is - an article in Wikipedia:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne...ian_Federation
This is your reliable fact - an article in Wikipedia written by hundreds of authors?
And why did you choose the English version of Wikipedia, or do you not know that in Wikipedia you can write anything and it exists in many languages?
Why did not you take as a basis the Ukrainian version of these events?
https://uk.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/&#10..._(з_2014)
Or the Russian version of events in the Crimea?
https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Крымский_кризис

Or is the English version "the most correct"?)
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