[phoenixbmwlife]

There are many future thinking consumers like myself that love the i8 for what it is and would love it to be even more. And when the world sees the inevitable gas crisis due to the Saudis gouging oil prices to make $5 a gallon for gasoline, because they understand that their time for big oil profits is almost up. Every single car manufacturer will be pushing out much more hybrids and electric cars.

[Aye-eight]

Originally Posted by clbmw

Credit to BMW for doing it but...

...instead of listening to people who aren't buying it because it has a small 3 pot instead of a 6 pot or V8 and can't compete with other cars in the segment (oh wait sorry I forgot no one considers a 911 Turbo or R8 a competitor when spending 130k) BMW remove the engine.

Audi just did this and scrapped it in favour of an NA V10

I have no problem with electric cars but do it bottom up, not top down, after all supercars are niche and contribute very little to world pollution.

But hey what do I know , I'm just a customer

Technology almost always trickles top-down, not bottom up. You've got to get first movers to spend in order to generate appetite in the broader market and make scaling up commercially viable. Pretty much all the engine technology we know now, all the driver aids, all the materials used in the mass market started in an expensive niche somewhere.

To quote Henry Ford: "If I had asked the customers what they wanted, they would have said 'A faster horse'!"

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Eddien123

We're little fish In a very large pond. BMW doesn't care what enthusiasts think or want anymore. They make more selling to the masses.

BMW is a business. A business needs to grow in order to stay alive. The 5-10% of enthusiasts in the market can not keep BMW alive. The 90% to 95% of normal drivers that will go to the grocery store, work and home can, though. Does it suck? Yes. This is the future, though. The combustion engine is at the end of it's lifecycle. Either you adapt, or you're forgotten about.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Aye-eight

Technology almost always trickles top-down, not bottom up. You've got to get first movers to spend in order to generate appetite in the broader market and make scaling up commercially viable. Pretty much all the engine technology we know now, all the driver aids, all the materials used in the mass market started in an expensive niche somewhere.

To quote Henry Ford: "If I had asked the customers what they wanted, they would have said 'A faster horse'!"

Well said.

[phoenixbmwlife]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Quick question for scott26.

The Autocar article says the i8 may have 3 electric motors. two in the rear and one upfront with each of them good for 268HP. Does that mean we could see a fully electric i8 with up to 804 combined HP??? That would be a serious Electric car.

[clbmw]

Now that I've stopped whinging I'm quite intrigued as to what an all electric i8 will actually be like (hopefully more successful than Audi's attempt )

[Twitch Massacre]

Originally Posted by BRCHP

Who cares

Gee, I dunno... People interested in a 800+hp future-proof vehicle and who aren't stuck in the ways of the dinosaur or opposed to progress.

[Twitch Massacre]

Originally Posted by clbmw

Credit to BMW for doing it but...

...instead of listening to people who aren't buying it because it has a small 3 pot instead of a 6 pot or V8 and can't compete with other cars in the segment (oh wait sorry I forgot no one considers a 911 Turbo or R8 a competitor when spending 130k) BMW remove the engine.

Audi just did this and scrapped it in favour of an NA V10

I have no problem with electric cars but do it bottom up, not top down, after all supercars are niche and contribute very little to world pollution.

But hey what do I know , I'm just a customer

If the Hypercar manufacturers are doing so form the top up, why can't BMW? The i8 was built to prove that technology like that of the 918 Spyder can be applied to an attainable sports car. And that the sports car, which has recently been a cause of concern for car manufacturers do to their ever declining sales, can still move forward into the future in a sustainable way. I'm still baffled by people who can't see how hybrid technology is moving performance forward and not holding it back. I actually find it disappointing that more manufacturers aren't participating in this. I was actually shocked and even disappointed when Bugatti unveiled the Chiron with basically the same old formula, instead of employing something similar to its cousin, the 918.

[EBM4]

Originally Posted by Needbmwpartzz

Thanks....guess I'm a skeptic for electrics.
I don't think the future infrastructure for electrics will not resemble that of fossil fuels especially with driverless cars...i think it will look more like mass transit without the mass....and don't even get me started on the economics of this tech....but I guess time will tell what technologies prevail....interesting times to come,staying tuned.

All new homes built in CA by 2020 will have solar in order to meet the net zero T-24 requirements which frees up a great deal of space on the current grid. In certain markets. Keep that in mind also.

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by Needbmwpartzz

Thanks....guess I'm a skeptic for electrics.
I don't think the future infrastructure for electrics will not resemble that of fossil fuels especially with driverless cars...i think it will look more like mass transit without the mass....and don't even get me started on the economics of this tech....but I guess time will tell what technologies prevail....interesting times to come,staying tuned.

Huge paradigm shift ..

Electrocution will dominate.

Zero-Emissions within the City.

Younger people do not care to drive.

People will live and work within a 5 mile radius.

In 5 years Tesla will be in the Top 10 Car Companies.

The rest of the car industry will play hell trying to catch them.

[SCOTT26]

Originally Posted by PhoenixWolf

Quick question for scott26.

The Autocar article says the i8 may have 3 electric motors. two in the rear and one upfront with each of them good for 268HP. Does that mean we could see a fully electric i8 with up to 804 combined HP??? That would be a serious Electric car.

At BMW we do have multiple i8 prototype models developed since the production car utilising various means of drivetrains and because of the specific nature they are tested behind closed doors.

These include an i8 with Hydrogen Fuel Cell, an Autonomous i8 and one driven by gesture and voice commands, as well as full electric in efficient but high performance specifications and utilising a four cylinder power plant. As well as the original Diesel idea concept.

It certainly is more of an evaluation in reaction to further progress but a full electric i8 is a strong possibility for additional inclusion.
Further proof contrary to media reports that BMWi has stagnated when actually development is continuing to bring progress and further appeal to the cars during the initial establishing period.

[Needbmwpartzz]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

I'm not entirely sure what "hydro infrastructure" is, but I like to be generous in my interpretation. I'm guessing it's some difference in regional slang, referring to the infrastructure that delivers electricity to homes? Let me know if I've got that wrong.

It's true that if everyone plugged in their electric cars at once, most countries current infrastructure would simply fall apart. However, I think it's a naive to assume that this scenario will play out. Everyone isn't going to buy an electric car overnight. Also, the cost per unit of energy for electricity is much, much lower than the equivalent cost for petrol. There is room for upward movement of electric utility prices that can more than cover the cost of infrastructure upgrades.

IMO, this single issue will not prevent the increased adoption of electric vehicles. It is a problem that will be solved — for the most part — outside of the view of the consumer, and consumers tend to care about things that are within their view. Compromises like poor range and long refueling (used as a euphemism for recharging) times are much greater inhibitors of adoption. The slow progress of increases in battery capacity incentivize a gradual transition.

So what is the penultimate technology that will surpass all-electric? Do you think we'll circle back around to heat engines?

I don't think batteries are the final destination, but I do think that electrics are here to stay. The primary driver of this being that with an electric, you centralize your power generation. With petrol, you've got a distributed power generation infrastructure. Each ICE powered automobile is its own little power generation facility. This is true even of non-hybrid ICE cars. Keep in mind that "power" is a unit of measure, just like centimeters and liters. In a traditional ICE, power is generated by combusting fuel, and is put to work directly. The otto-cycle ICE powerplant has a very finite thermodynamic efficiency ceiling, and there are no replacements on the horizon that look to break through this.

Contrast this with centralized power generation, and distributed storage. Centralized power generation has better thermodynamic efficiency in nearly every case. There is tremendous incentive to optimize this, because power generation facilities make or break their business on the margin they can squeeze out of a commodity market. You also have more options in a centralized model. When it comes to large scale power generation, we (as a society) actually have some really solid options already.

The distributed storage challenge is the one we haven't fully cracked yet. Lithium ion energy efficiency is positively incredible when compared to pretty much any heat engine (if you think of the fuel as a storage medium). The problem is that you have to factor in the energy expense of hauling around the battery. Lithium ion batteries are very, very heavy. We need higher power density, and faster charge/discharge cycles. Progress is being made, but it's slow.

Your interpretation is correct....bingo!
You have many great points but I'm still seeing electrics they are today as simply a..no other option approach..to further advance technology away from ICE's.
Other advancements in generation and storage must be made.....perhaps thorium will be one of the fuels....I don't know but battery packs must find a miracle for me to buy electric as a primary vehicle as I demand at solid 600km range in any condition.....currently I don't think this is possible.....but like I said before....prove me wrong because today the all electric market is still a niche market with less than 0.1% of all vehicles worldwide.

[phoenixbmwlife]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

At BMW we do have multiple i8 prototype models developed since the production car utilising various means of drivetrains and because of the specific nature they are tested behind closed doors.

These include an i8 with Hydrogen Fuel Cell, an Autonomous i8 and one driven by gesture and voice commands, as well as full electric in efficient but high performance specifications and utilising a four cylinder power plant. As well as the original Diesel idea concept.

It certainly is more of an evaluation in reaction to further progress but a full electric i8 is a strong possibility for additional inclusion.
Further proof contrary to media reports that BMWi has stagnated when actually development is continuing to bring progress and further appeal to the cars during the initial establishing period.

Thanks for the response.

All I can say is whatever they are working on, it is very exciting indeed. I vote for an 800+hp with instant tq all electric car if they can keep weight under 4000lbs. They will be in the hyper car territory at a fraction of the cost. And since the Competition is only getting better, they need to establish a platform that is obviously profitable for BMW, but at the same time very competitive in the electric sports/super/hyper car market. Just my 2 cents.

[jhbi8]

I like the idea. 250 range is what I want to see.

My two fun cars are a BMW i8 and a 1250hp modified Lamborgini Gallardo. I love the i8. Love love love it.

Do I love the crazy power and roar of the V10, yeah, but for everyday awesomeness the i8 is currently my favorite flavor.

[twm6]

Originally Posted by jhbi8

I like the idea. 250 range is what I want to see.

My two fun cars are a BMW i8 and a 1250hp modified Lamborgini Gallardo. I love the i8. Love love love it.

Do I love the crazy power and roar of the V10, yeah, but for everyday awesomeness the i8 is currently my favorite flavor.

i can totally relate to what you mean, especially pulling into the garage from a spirited run in my super trofeo stradale and pulling out in the i8...cant get enough of that!!!

[antzcrashing]

Originally Posted by DJKapeesh

This is what happens when Tesla leaks their pattents

Patents lol. It takes design teams years to develop systems and software that works for these highly application-specific products. Tesla is just creating buzz when they give out patents. Bmw is still starting from square 1

[Oliver1]

If Europe electrifies their motorways for the trucking industry, the automobile industry will be forced to follow suit.

The world’s cargo fleet is moving from fossil fuels to electrons. But powering them won’t be simple. With today’s technology, driving a semi-truck 500 miles (804 kilometers) would require a 23-ton lithium-ion battery, half the weight of the truck itself. Fuel cells would need a massive, $2 million hydrogen fuel tank to go the distance. Embedding wireless charging coils in roadbed would be expensive and inefficient.

But an invention first deployed in 1870 to power trains and streetcars might be the perfect fit: catenary, overhead electrical wires commonly found around the world. The German engineering company Siemens, presenting at an electric vehicle conference in Montreal this month, argues it can power unlimited-distance electric trucks with intermittent overhead wires that provide enough energy for fast-moving, long-haul highway journeys.

With on-board batteries added to the trucks, the company estimates all of Germany’s roads could be can be outfitted for long-distance electric hauling with just 4,000 km of wire. Trucks would be able to recharge on highways and operate on battery power while on rural and urban streets. The system would cost a fraction the price of alternatives like hydrogen fuel cells, and deliver as much as €200 billion ($227 billion) in net savings over 30 years compared with other approaches, reports IDTechEx, which attended the presentation.

The technology is ready to go. New advances in catenary systems allow hybrid vehicles to switch seamlessly between overhead charging and battery power at high-speeds. For now, the trucks are diesel hybrids, but extensive overhead wires and efficient batteries would permit the vehicles to eliminate internal combustions engines entirely.

Siemans, joined by Volvo, Scania, and several national and local governments, is already starting field trials. Sweden launched the first such trucks on public roads on June 22 with its E15 test highway north of Stockholm . The country plans to eliminate fossil fuel from its transportation sector by 2030. California’s own eHighway is deploying similar trucks along a 1-mile (1.6 kilometers) stretch between ports in Los Angeles and Long Beach though 2017.

[raysspl]

It better go full EV

[shivaswrath]

So copying Tesla.....

[N & M]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

At BMW we do have multiple i8 prototype models developed since the production car utilising various means of drivetrains and because of the specific nature they are tested behind closed doors.

These include an i8 with Hydrogen Fuel Cell, an Autonomous i8 and one driven by gesture and voice commands, as well as full electric in efficient but high performance specifications and utilising a four cylinder power plant. As well as the original Diesel idea concept.

It certainly is more of an evaluation in reaction to further progress but a full electric i8 is a strong possibility for additional inclusion.
Further proof contrary to media reports that BMWi has stagnated when actually development is continuing to bring progress and further appeal to the cars during the initial establishing period.

I think they meant that no new product has appeared since the launch of i3 and i8.

[fishpond]

As long as it has a range extender (REX) option like the i3, I fully support a predominantly electric i8.

Given that the charging infrastructure is very poor, having a small ICE backup/REX on board is the key to making this usable and viable option for longer journeys.

[Aye-eight]

Originally Posted by fishpond

As long as it has a range extender (REX) option like the i3, I fully support a predominantly electric i8.

Given that the charging infrastructure is very poor, having a small ICE backup/REX on board is the key to making this usable and viable option for longer journeys.

I hear what you're saying. After all, a lot of us here (me included) saw the absence of range anxiety as one of the reasons to go for an i8 over a Tesla.

That said, by the time this new i8 comes out, the charging landscape will already look very different. And I'm not sure I'm a fan of the idea of a much larger battery PLUS a small ICE with gas tank, exhaust system, etc.