[outie]

Originally Posted by brava09

My problem wit EV is recharging time.

With my M4 I often feel the need to beat the crap out of it, empty the tank in half hour, fill it back in 3 minutes and do it again.

With EV? Not possible, empty the batteries, performance drops and need couple of hours to recharge, not good. I need 3 minutes recharge time, and maintain performance while battery empties

Couple of hours to recharge? I take that you never owned one and don’t know the reality.
I took delivery of my Taycan GTS few weeks ago in NorCal and had to drive 400mi+ back home in SoCal. I had to stop twice, each less than 30min (first one was 25min second was 10min) using Electricfy America charging stations (free 30min sessions for 3 years) that were abundant throughout the route, with no wait. These things charge way faster than the 2 Teslas I still own using Supercharger.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by machop

This reminds of early Apple days when iPhone/iPad first released. People making fun of it, and hard core Apple fans loved it. Then people realized how easy to use and they started gaining popularity. Apple today has about half smart phone market share. there are still lots of people who refuse to use Apple products.

I think EV market in 10 years will be similar to this, EV total percentage market share in sales probably will reach 30-40%, lots of people still drive ICE. Is 30% a success for EV, I think so.

The Apple analogy has been drawn before and it is not comparable.

P.S. 10 years ago this conversation took place and in that decade you did not see widespread EV acceptance. We won't see it in another 10 years either.

Originally Posted by outie

Couple of hours to recharge? I take that you never owned one and don't know the reality.
I took delivery of my Taycan GTS few weeks ago in NorCal and had to drive 400mi+ back home in SoCal. I had to stop twice, each less than 30min (first one was 25min second was 10min) using Electricfy America charging stations (free 30min sessions for 3 years) that were abundant throughout the route, with no wait. These things charge way faster than the 2 Teslas I still own using Supercharger.

The reality is that charging only takes a couple of hours IF you have a 220v outlet or some supercharger access. Many do not, so 110v charging at home takes FOREVER. Many don't have the option of charging at work either……and if they do, it's very limited so not everybody can charge. At least acknowledge that not everybody is subject(ed) to the same resource accessibility as conveniently as others.

[P1]

I don't have a problem with EV. For my daily beater, EV should be just fine. Drop the kids of at school, run to the supermarket. But why can't you just give me a "regular" X5 and turn that into an EV? Why do I now need to consider this ugly iX that's missing half of the X5s interior?

Message to all the OEMs (and I get there are exceptions):

stop
making
ugly
EVs

[DFTBA]

Where as most discussed Ev vs. Non EV (i have the two on order), I don’t understand a drag race where one of the two doesn’t use its launch control.

[JonoNZ]

Originally Posted by P1

I don't have a problem with EV. For my daily beater, EV should be just fine. Drop the kids of at school, run to the supermarket. But why can't you just give me a "regular" X5 and turn that into an EV? Why do I now need to consider this ugly iX that's missing half of the X5s interior?

Message to all the OEMs (and I get there are exceptions):

stop
making
ugly
EVs

Obviously completely subjective, but when the the iX and X5 are put next to each other in the showroom the iX looks really great, and the X5 looks pretty dated to me. Just my opinion, but the iX styling ages the rest of the BMW range (except the i4, M3, M4).

[hugo_nz]

Originally Posted by DFTBA

Where as most discussed Ev vs. Non EV (i have the two on order), I don’t understand a drag race where one of the two doesn’t use its launch control.

I don’t think the 40 or 50 have launch control. It appears to be reserved for the M60.

[Crisp]

I enjoy my sound. I don't care about the cost of fuel.
EV can be the future for others, along with microwaves. I enjoy taking my time and cooking my steak on the grill.

My daily is a 750hp V8 TT and just picked up a V10 and a V12 for more eargasm.

Enjoy the microwaves boys! They're plenty quiet, comfortable and fast.

I'll enjoy the open flames and sweet tunes of an ICE (not to be confused with the burble backfiring pieces of sht).

[chayden2005]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

It is significant, I agree. Her home is less than a year old and the electricity bill only changed after we began plugging in her vehicle. I'm thinking because it is actively charging most days for 10-12 hours at a time, that's the reason for the spike. Maybe the monthly monetary figure will decrease once I install the 220v outlet because charge time will be 3-4 hours max.

If your a SCE customer, make sure they didn't change you to a time of use plan. I got a letter from them last year that looked like a regular garbage mailer, but ended up being a disguised letter.
Said if I didn't specifically respond by a certain time, they were going to change me from a tiered plan to a time of use. The only way to survive that plan is Solar with battery storage to get you through the dark hours until the rate lowers back down.
Needless to say, a time of use plan kills you from 4 pm to 10pm. Rates quadruple. Could be the reason there was such a huge jump in the bill. Obviously an EV is going to increase your electric usage but I'd recommend also checking what they're charging you. Most of us use auto pay and just tend to pay our bills without reviewing them closely.

[patrobX5]

Originally Posted by JonoNZ

Obviously completely subjective, but when the the iX and X5 are put next to each other in the showroom the iX looks really great, and the X5 looks pretty dated to me. Just my opinion, but the iX styling ages the rest of the BMW range (except the i4, M3, M4).

I feel the same way, X5 looks dated compared to iX which is so fresh and modern.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by chayden2005

If your a SCE customer, make sure they didn't change you to a time of use plan. I got a letter from them last year that looked like a regular garbage mailer, but ended up being a disguised letter.
Said if I didn't specifically respond by a certain time, they were going to change me from a tiered plan to a time of use. The only way to survive that plan is Solar with battery storage to get you through the dark hours until the rate lowers back down.
Needless to say, a time of use plan kills you from 4 pm to 10pm. Rates quadruple. Could be the reason there was such a huge jump in the bill. Obviously an EV is going to increase your electric usage but I'd recommend also checking what they're charging you. Most of us use auto pay and just tend to pay our bills without reviewing them closely.

Thank you so much for this. It is entirely possible this happened. I'm going to forward this to her. I confirmed with her today that her most recent bill was $300, so still incredibly high.

[Sedan_Clan]

I followed up with her and she's on a mandatory time-of-use plan through SDGE. Because it takes so long to charge, the hours overlap to the highest rate.

[Paladin1]

Speaking of electric speed, as an aside, new record for the Goodwood Hill run at FOS - 0-60mph in under 1.5s. Yes, you read that right:

10 fastest:

[noushy]

We have a X5M comp and should be getting our iX M60 next month will be interesting to compare them.

Noushy

[TXSchnee]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I followed up with her and she's on a mandatory time-of-use plan through SDGE. Because it takes so long to charge, the hours overlap to the highest rate.

She will definitely see a reduction in her electric bill with a level 2 EVSE. Hopefully that can get installed pretty soon, ridiculous there is a mandatory time of use plan. We recently did solar panels (9.33kWH system) and 3 Powerwalls for backup, TX grid is a piece of sh*t, she may want to look onto a small solar panel system to offset that electric bill.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by TXSchnee

She will definitely see a reduction in her electric bill with a level 2 EVSE. Hopefully that can get installed pretty soon, ridiculous there is a mandatory time of use plan. We recently did solar panels (9.33kWH system) and 3 Powerwalls for backup, TX grid is a piece of sh*t, she may want to look onto a small solar panel system to offset that electric bill.

As soon as we have both recovered, I'll install the level two EVSE. Solar is something being considered, but her homeowner's association is a piece of work. Everything has to be approved by them, and obtaining that approval is like trying to find a flea on a silverback gorilla.

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Well, I suppose we'll see who I wins this debate over the next decade.

My lady has a BMW 530e. She doesn't have a 220v charger (…although her new home is wired for it, I just need to install the outlet itself), so she plugs into a 110v outlet. To obtain a full charge it take anywhere from 8-10 hours; it'll be 3-4 with the 220v. What she saves at the pump reflects in the increased cost in her electricity bill. Her electricity bill has increased about $200 a month since she began plugging in. She does not have solar panels. Based on her real world use case it is almost a wash. Fortunately she can run on gas so it isn't super concerning, but she will not go EV.

Either you are driving a ton of mileage (41590 miles per year), or you are paying high kWh charges. At 41590 miles per year, and $6/gal, you would spending $831/month in a 25 mpg gas car compared to your $200/month electric car at .15 cent/kWh.


Calculations:
@15 cents per kWh, $200/mo would buy you 1333 kWh/month

1333kWh x 2.6 miles per/kWh = 3465 miles/month= 41,590 mi/year.


3465 miles per month/25 mpg= 138.6 gal x $6= $831.6 gas cost vs $200 electric costs.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by hotrod182

Either you are driving a ton of mileage (40000 miles per year), or you are paying high kWh charges. A 40000 miles per year, and $6/gal, you would spending $800/month in a 25 mpg gas car compared to your $200/month electric car at .15 cent/kWh.

@15 cents per kWh, $200 would by you 1333 kWh/month

1333kWh x 2.6 miles per/kWh = 3465 miles/month= 41,590 mi/year.


3465 miles per month/25 mpg= 138.6 gal x $6= $831.6 gas cost vs $200 electric costs.

Read the entire thread.


…and your math is off because your mileage example is far lower than what we actually achieve in our cars.


….and who said anything about driving 40k a year?!?

[Electric Sloth]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

As soon as we have both recovered, I'll install the level two EVSE. Solar is something being considered, but her homeowner's association is a piece of work. Everything has to be approved by them, and obtaining that approval is like trying to find a flea on a silverback gorilla.

You should look at this HOA / Solar law summary for CA. When I lived in CA my HOA was a nightmare (took 3 months to get paint colors approved), but the only condition they came back with on solar was the conduit couldn’t run over the peak from one side to the other.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Electric Sloth

You should look at this HOA / Solar law summary for CA. When I lived in CA my HOA was a nightmare (took 3 months to get paint colors approved), but the only condition they came back with on solar was the conduit couldn't run over the peak from one side to the other.

Thanks for that. I'll read through that today. I honestly don't think I've seen any solar panels on any of the single family homes or townhomes in her community.

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Read the entire thread.


…and your math is off because your mileage example is far lower than what we actually achieve in our cars.


….and who said anything about driving 40k a year?!?

Exactly, these are worst case scenarios.
I understand you could pay way more for electricity in Hawaii vs Washington. And get gas for less in other states than California. But that's not the point. You implied that the amount you pay in electricity is as much as the gas you offset. That is your use situation, but shouldn't be implied as being applicable to others on this forum. Because for most people, the electricity costs are far less than the gas you are saving. 40K a year? That was said because most people who spent $200/month on electricity charging their EVs could drive 40,000 miles per year on the electrical energy $200/month buys. And this is based on 2.6 mi/kWh, which most EVs will better. Unfortunately the 530e is at the lower end of the efficiency spectrum.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by hotrod182

I understand you could pay way more for electricity in Hawaii vs Washington. And get gas for less in other states than California. But that's not the point. You implied that the amount you pay in electricity is as much as the gas you offset. That is your use situation, but shouldn't be implied as being applicable to others on this forum. Because for most people, the electricity costs are far less than the gas you are saving. 40K a year? That was said because most people who spent $200/month on electricity charging their EVs could drive 40,000 miles per year on the electrical energy $200/month buys. And this is based on 2.6 mi/kWh, which most EVs will better. Unfortunately the 530e is at the lower end of the efficiency spectrum.

Never once did I extrapolate my/her use case to others on this forum. In fact, I've gone out of my way to state EXPLICITLY that everybody's use case and access to certain resources is different. What is convenient for one may be inconvenient for another.

[hotrod182]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Never once did I extrapolate my/her use case to others on this forum. In fact, I've gone out of my way to state EXPLICITLY that everybody's use case and access to certain resources is different. What is convenient for one may be inconvenient for another.

Exactly, you are the exception to the rule. Your first post on the subject said that any gas savings is offset by your increased electric cost. And you also stated she will not be going EV. So here you are mentioning what would be construed as negative aspects of EV ownership, and yet you mentioned nothing about being your utility rate structure being a big piece of the puzzle. These are things that were derived in later posts when people were perplexed by your abnormal cost claims. Perhaps it would be more informative if you told us how many miles you drive. $200/mo for electricity is expensive, but not if you drive 40,000 miles per year, when comparing to $800 of gas for the same distance. Crucial information this is missing if someone is to make sense of what you are claiming.