[NomoTesla]

I just read in the i4 forum that an out-of-warranty battery replacement for that car is $92,000, which exceeds the MSRP of a new i4 by a healthy amount. If true, this is an untenable situation making long-term ownership a virtual impossibility unless one wants to write off the entire vehicle if the battery fails.

How much does it cost for an out-of-warranty battery replacement for the iX?

Link to the i4 thread: https://bmwi.bimmerpost.com/forums/s...5#post30777505

[drbluedevil]

I'd believe it. I'd bet 80-90% of the cost will be labor.

My old iX was rear-ended in 5/2023, and there was no damage to the electrical system at all. By 11/2023, it was STILL being repaired, and the bill, which was still climbing, was approaching 35k.

My old X5m experienced a spontaneous engine failure (metal shavings of unexplained etiology were found on disassembly), and they recommended a total engine/turbo replacement, which costed $49k for parts and labor. This was covered under my extended warranty, but the vehicle was only worth $36k at the time. I asked about just having them write me a check for the value of the car, and amazingly, they said no.

The point of these stories is that it must be dramatically cheaper and more efficient to build these from scratch than to disassemble and then reassemble them out of the order that makes the most sense from a manufacturing perspective.

It's eye-popping how expensive these EV repairs are. And I'm glad it's this way now, because as this generation's vehicles start needing major repairs, it'll call attention to their irreparability to consumers and insurance agencies, which will put downward pressure on price/desirability, and manufacturers will focus on ease of repairability in future designs. I bet once solid state batteries become mainstream, manufacturers will leverage the smaller size and reduced need for internal battery heating (reducing complexity) to design these to be swappable modules. I envision a future in which battery packs can just be swapped out with pre-charged ones at service stations or dealers. Perhaps as a part of a subscription model, if that suits the customer.

[NomoTesla]

Originally Posted by drbluedevil

I'd believe it. I'd bet 80-90% of the cost will be labor.

My old iX was rear-ended in 5/2023, and there was no damage to the electrical system at all. By 11/2023, it was STILL being repaired, and the bill, which was still climbing, was approaching 35k.

My old X5m experienced a spontaneous engine failure (metal shavings of unexplained etiology were found on disassembly), and they recommended a total engine/turbo replacement, which costed $49k for parts and labor. This was covered under my extended warranty, but the vehicle was only worth $36k at the time. I asked about just having them write me a check for the value of the car, and amazingly, they said no.

The point of these stories is that it must be dramatically cheaper and more efficient to build these from scratch than to disassemble and then reassemble them out of the order that makes the most sense from a manufacturing perspective.

It's eye-popping how expensive these EV repairs are. And I'm glad it's this way now, because as this generation's vehicles start needing major repairs, it'll call attention to their irreparability to consumers and insurance agencies, which will put downward pressure on price/desirability, and manufacturers will focus on ease of repairability in future designs. I bet once solid state batteries become mainstream, manufacturers will leverage the smaller size and reduced need for internal battery heating (reducing complexity) to design these to be swappable modules. I envision a future in which battery packs can just be swapped out with pre-charged ones at service stations or dealers. Perhaps as a part of a subscription model, if that suits the customer.

These prices are simply outrageous. Like the Hyundia/Kia owner who received a $65k estimate to replace his battery, causing the insurance carrier to completely write-off a one-year-old car. I don't know anyone who could afford to write a check like that to get their car moving again.

Batteries should be leased, or at least there should be an extended warranty option for the battery to cover it indefinitely and for unlimited miles. The iX battery, and presumably the i4 battery, are designed for modules to be swapped in and out. I suspect that if a module goes bad the repair cost will be substantially less. A whole new pack would likely only be needed if there is an accident or external event that would likely be covered by insurance.

What gives me pause is Tesla's full-frontal push into the non-repairability of their battery packs. Tesla just replaces the entire pack even if only a handful of cells are bad. I hope this model isn't adopted by BMW.

[drbluedevil]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

These prices are simply outrageous. Like the Hyundia/Kia owner who received a $65k estimate to replace his battery, causing the insurance carrier to completely write-off a one-year-old car. I don't know anyone who could afford to write a check like that to get their car moving again.

Batteries should be leased, or at least there should be an extended warranty option for the battery to cover it indefinitely and for unlimited miles. The iX battery, and presumably the i4 battery, are designed for modules to be swapped in and out. I suspect that if a module goes bad the repair cost will be substantially less. A whole new pack would likely only be needed if there is an accident or external event that would likely be covered by insurance.

What gives me pause is Tesla's full-frontal push into the non-repairability of their battery packs. Tesla just replaces the entire pack even if only a handful of cells are bad. I hope this model isn't adopted by BMW.

Absolutely. The limiting factor will be insurability. As high dollar claims pile up, the actuaries will be able to more accurately price in risk, and the insurance cost will skyrocket.

If comprehensive/collision coverage costs 5k/6 months, sales will go to 0 until manufacturers address repairability in earnest.

Same thing is happening with housing in particularly high risk coastal and fire-prone areas.

[Paladin1]

400v 3-phase charger could have had something to do with it....

[Pictor]

I'm sure glad there is an 8-Year and 100,000 mile warranty. But that price is excessive even for a dealer. Surely there will be some good aftermarket options available in a few years.

[ricerboi]

Originally Posted by Pictor

I'm sure glad there is an 8-Year and 100,000 mile warranty. But that price is excessive even for a dealer. Surely there will be some good aftermarket options available in a few years.

Hope so. 8 years/120k in some states. I’m gonna hit 120k in 2 years so kinda nervous. I wonder if value will drop to 20k-30k at that point.

[drbluedevil]

Originally Posted by ricerboi

Hope so. 8 years/120k in some states. I’m gonna hit 120k in 2 years so kinda nervous. I wonder if value will drop to 20k-30k at that point.

Living in California, you'll have saved about $7,421,231 in gas by that point, so you're way ahead

[ricerboi]

Originally Posted by drbluedevil

Living in California, you'll have saved about $7,421,231 in gas by that point, so you're way ahead

lol yeah especially when the alternative is my TTV8 16mpg X5 @$4.79-7.29/gallon over the last 17 months.

[Windshieldfarmer]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

What gives me pause is Tesla's full-frontal push into the non-repairability of their battery packs. Tesla just replaces the entire pack even if only a handful of cells are bad. I hope this model isn't adopted by BMW.

I absolutely agree. Tesla’s approach to using structural battery packs will surely render their autos as non serviceable throwaways. Perhaps this is already showing up in the cost of insurance. When I inquired with my agent about the cost of insuring the IX I also asked about the cost of insuring a Model Y. Surprisingly, the IX and Y cost the same even though the MSRP on the IX was $40,000 more.

[hugo_nz]

The parts diagrams no longer list a kit as being available for complete battery replacement, but I did some digging and found kit part numbers anyway. They do not show up in BMW Air, but searching them on part sites and some BMW retailers return hits. No idea if they are still valid but should give at least some indication of battery replacement cost...

[exxxviii]

Originally Posted by Windshieldfarmer

I absolutely agree. Tesla’s approach to using structural battery packs will surely render their autos as non serviceable throwaways. Perhaps this is already showing up in the cost of insurance. When I inquired with my agent about the cost of insuring the IX I also asked about the cost of insuring a Model Y. Surprisingly, the IX and Y cost the same even though the MSRP on the IX was $40,000 more.

My insurance went up about $400 year going from Model Y to iX. I figured it was the glass roof and general BMW expense driving the differential.

[RixT]

Originally Posted by drbluedevil

It's eye-popping how expensive these EV repairs are. .... which will put downward pressure on price/desirability

That is a significant point for future iX values. Vehicles here in the UK have 3 year warranty, it wont be long before we have vehicles being outside of warranty and the true cost of repair from faults, digital or mechanical that would be a warranty no-cost fix, starts to affect the precepted value and reputation of the vehicle. There will also be a threshold of older vehicles, say five or six years old, that simple accidents have immediate write-off - eg a front-end collision is £10K for the laser headlights alone. Certainly doesn't bode well for post warranty resale values.

[FultonMDUSA]

Originally Posted by exxxviii

My insurance went up about $400 year going from Model Y to iX. I figured it was the glass roof and general BMW expense driving the differential.

Geico, upcoming March 2024 renewal, I'm still paying more for my Model Y vs. iX.

[exxxviii]

Originally Posted by FultonMDUSA

Geico, upcoming March 2024 renewal, I'm still paying more for my Model Y vs. iX.

Ugh. I need to call my insurance company. My 6 month premium went from about $800 to $1,200 from Y to iX. (Your rates crush mine in general, but I had a minor accident a few years ago.

[johnwc723]

I had the opposite happen with insurance. I had a Model 3 long range that was two years old worth 35K and my insurance price was $1400 now with the IX M60 which is 9 months old worth 80K I’m at $700.🤞

[thebishman]

Originally Posted by Windshieldfarmer

I absolutely agree. Tesla’s approach to using structural battery packs will surely render their autos as non serviceable throwaways. Perhaps this is already showing up in the cost of insurance. When I inquired with my agent about the cost of insuring the IX I also asked about the cost of insuring a Model Y. Surprisingly, the IX and Y cost the same even though the MSRP on the IX was $40,000 more.

I think the other major issues for insurers is the ‘mega casting’ that Tesla is now using. It makes it cheaper to make the car no doubt, but so much more difficult to repair even a minor accident. Not that Musk could give a toss about the fact that relatively small defects are causing insurers to write off the car. Is it any surprise what this is doing, or will do to all of our rates?

[drbluedevil]

Originally Posted by thebishman

I think the other major issues for insurers is the ‘mega casting’ that Tesla is now using. It makes it cheaper to make the car no doubt, but so much more difficult to repair even a minor accident. Not that Musk could give a toss about the fact that relatively small defects are causing insurers to write off the car. Is it any surprise what this is doing, or will do to all of our rates?

But he eventually WILL care if the vehicles become so expensive to repair and consequently to insure, that nobody buys them.

[NomoTesla]

Originally Posted by thebishman

I think the other major issues for insurers is the ‘mega casting’ that Tesla is now using. It makes it cheaper to make the car no doubt, but so much more difficult to repair even a minor accident. Not that Musk could give a toss about the fact that relatively small defects are causing insurers to write off the car. Is it any surprise what this is doing, or will do to all of our rates?

Originally Posted by drbluedevil

But he eventually WILL care if the vehicles become so expensive to repair and consequently to insure, that nobody buys them.

Ah, but Tesla also sells car insurance…

[freshxdough]

Originally Posted by NomoTesla

I just read in the i4 forum that an out-of-warranty battery replacement for that car is $92,000, which exceeds the MSRP of a new i4 by a healthy amount. If true, this is an untenable situation making long-term ownership a virtual impossibility unless one wants to write off the entire vehicle if the battery fails.

How much does it cost for an out-of-warranty battery replacement for the iX?

Link to the i4 thread: https://bmwi.bimmerpost.com/forums/s...5#post30777505

This was under warranty as I clearly stated in that thread.

[freshxdough]

Originally Posted by drbluedevil

I'd believe it. I'd bet 80-90% of the cost will be labor.

My old iX was rear-ended in 5/2023, and there was no damage to the electrical system at all. By 11/2023, it was STILL being repaired, and the bill, which was still climbing, was approaching 35k.

My old X5m experienced a spontaneous engine failure (metal shavings of unexplained etiology were found on disassembly), and they recommended a total engine/turbo replacement, which costed $49k for parts and labor. This was covered under my extended warranty, but the vehicle was only worth $36k at the time. I asked about just having them write me a check for the value of the car, and amazingly, they said no.

The point of these stories is that it must be dramatically cheaper and more efficient to build these from scratch than to disassemble and then reassemble them out of the order that makes the most sense from a manufacturing perspective.

It's eye-popping how expensive these EV repairs are. And I'm glad it's this way now, because as this generation's vehicles start needing major repairs, it'll call attention to their irreparability to consumers and insurance agencies, which will put downward pressure on price/desirability, and manufacturers will focus on ease of repairability in future designs. I bet once solid state batteries become mainstream, manufacturers will leverage the smaller size and reduced need for internal battery heating (reducing complexity) to design these to be swappable modules. I envision a future in which battery packs can just be swapped out with pre-charged ones at service stations or [...]

92k was just parts. OP did not properly quote the previous thread. Total for the entire repair on that repair was $102,000. Couple control units and labor added to the 92k.

[NomoTesla]

Originally Posted by freshxdough

92k was just parts. OP did not properly quote the previous thread. Total for the entire repair on that repair was $102,000. Couple control units and labor added to the 92k.

OP was outraged enough at $92k, $102k may have made him faint!