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      01-25-2024, 09:45 AM   #1
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BMW’s Gen 6 Batteries Said To Offer 620 Miles Range

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Below are two articles that together make so many very positive claims about the next 6th generation batteries that BMW will be using starting in 2025 in their Neue Klasse EV’s. The title/thesis of this thread (Up To 620 Miles of Range) is one heck of a statement made by InsideEV’s, their quoting as their source Autocar. I sure hope it is true. At the same time note that both articles are now over 3 years old…

But could that the 620 mile range statement and all the many additional positive things about the gen 6 batteries alleged in both articles below are true including: Lighter, be able to be packaged more efficiently, cost half as much to make as current EV vehicle batteries, and so much more (all listed in the 2nd article below) and still 620 mile range???

Again I am not believing all this but AutoCar is not some fly-by-night fantasy company.

Quote:
Originally Posted by InsideEV’s
BMW's Upcoming Gen6 Battery Tech To Offer 620 Miles Of Range

The new, cylindrical cells are set to come to market in 2025.

Sep 15, 2022

By: Steven Loveday

Just last week, we told you in great detail about BMW's next-gen battery tech, which will improve range and charging speed, among other factors. Now, we've learned that the upcoming battery technology will offer an impressive 620 miles of electric driving range.
BMW recently announced its upcoming Gen6 cells, which are due to come to market in 2025. The cylindrical cells are expected to provide a wide variety of advantages over the current Gen5 prismatic cells, which are flat.
According to a report by Autocar, BMW’s head of Efficient Dynamics Thomas Albrecht said the Gen6 battery tech adds at least 30 percent more range, and while BMW could add even more range, it's going to cap it. He told the publication:
“Gen6 batteries will give us 30% or more range than our current Gen5, but we won’t go over 1000km [620 miles] of range, even though we can. We don’t think that such a long range is necessary.”
The article notes that BMW's Gen6 battery packs could be about 10 to 20 percent lighter than the Gen5 packs currently used in the brand's EVs. The new cell shape also allows for a battery pack that's thinner than the current style, and the pack itself will basically serve as part of the body structure of the EV it inhabits. The head of the battery cell department at BMW, Marie-Therese von Srbik said:

“With this next generation of battery, we will be much more flexible with how we integrate the cell. The whole vehicle is becoming more adaptive towards that.”

Autocar reiterated that with the Gen6 battery pack, DC Fast Charging times stand to improve by as much as 30 percent. In addition, BMW's future EVs with the new pack will support 270 kW fast charging.

Albrecht also told Autocar that while the US will likely require an EV battery to maintain 80 percent performance over 10 years, BMW's battery tech is already expected to perform better.

Official: BMW To Use Round Battery Cells, 6 Gigafactories Confirmed
As we previously reported, BMW will open six new battery factories related to the Gen6 cells. The investment is expected to pay off, however, as the new technology and manufacturing practices should result in a 50 percent drop in costs.
Source: Autocar

https://insideevs.com/news/610586/bm...20-mile-range/



****2nd article, also from InsideEV’s

[Quote= Official: BMW To Use Round Battery Cells, 6 Gigafactories Confirmed
The company intends to switch to cylindrical lithium-ion battery cells with the launch of Neue Klasse EVs in 2025.

Sep 10, 2022

By: Mark Kane

BMW Group has released a major announcement regarding lithium-ion batteries for its upcoming next-generation Neue Klasse electric cars, scheduled for 2025.
The German manufacturer has officially confirmed the switch from prismatic cells to cylindrical lithium-ion battery cells (as reported in May 2022), optimized for Neue Klasse architecture.
According to the company, the move to a new cell format, combined with improved chemistry and a new battery pack approach, will result in significantly better performance, lower costs and reduced environmental impact at the production plants.
The gains quoted by BMW are pretty big, including up to a 50% cost reduction on the pack level.

BMW round cell
The newly-developed "BMW round cells", for the sixth generation of BMW eDrive technology, have a standard diameter of 46 millimeters, which is the same as in the case of Tesla's 4680-type cylindrical battery cells (see cell analysis and pack teardown).

UPDATE: However, there will be two different heights, which were disclosed in one of the press releases: 95 and 120 millimeters. For reference Tesla's 4680 cells have a height of 80 mm. It means a higher capacity per cell.
"With a diameter of 46 millimetres and two different heights of 95 and 120 millimetres, the new cells are a perfect match for the completely redesigned and exclusively all-electric Neue Klasse architecture."
According to BMW, the company has fundamentally refined the cell format, cell chemistry and pack, which compared to 5th generation prismatic batteries will result in:
* more than 20% higher volumetric energy density
(no info about gravimetric energy density)
* up to 30% higher driving range (WLTP)
so potentially more than 800 km (500 miles) of range
* up to 30% improved charging speed (from 10% to 80% SOC)
* up to 50% lower cost on the pack level
* up to 60% reduced CO2 emission from cell production
(through green power and secondary material)
The lithium-ion chemistry appears to still be the NCM-type, but with a higher nickel content and reduced cobalt content in the cathode. On the anode side, the silicon content will be increased.
As a side note, there will be a potential for using round LFP-cathode chemistry as well, but nothing has been confirmed yet.
"sixth-generation battery technology also offers the option of using cathodes made of lithium iron phosphate (LFP) for the first time."
The new battery pack does not contain battery modules and might be a structural type (like in the case of Tesla's 4680), but it would require a confirmation from BMW:
"The battery system plays a key role in the body structure of the NEUE KLASSE. Depending on the model, it can be flexibly integrated into the installation space to save space (“pack to open body”). The cell module level is thus eliminated."
The voltage of the new battery system will be about 800 V. DC fast charging is expected to be much faster at a current of up to 500 A. It probably means that roughly 350 kW might be possible at peak.
Overall, fast charging from 10% to 80% state-of-charge (SOC) should be 30% faster than in the current, 5th battery generation.
One of the most important things is that the new battery systems (as a whole) are expected to be 50% less expensive, compared to the current fifth generation.
"By leveraging the comprehensive in-house expertise of the company’s own Battery Cell Competence Centre, the team from development, production and purchasing has been able to significantly reduce costs for the high-voltage battery, thanks to the new battery cell and new integration concept for battery technology developed by BMW."
"Based on current market assumptions, costs can be reduced by up to 50 percent, compared to the current fifth generation. The BMW Group has set itself the goal of bringing manufacturing costs for fully-electric models down to the same level as vehicles with state-of-the-art combustion-engine technology."
Frank Weber, member of the Board of Management of BMW AG responsible for Development said:
“The newly-developed sixth generation of our lithium-ion cells will bring a huge leap in technology that will increase energy density by more than 20 percent, improve charging speed by up to 30 percent and enhance range by up to 30 percent. We are also reducing CO2 emissions from cell production by up to 60 percent. These are big steps for sustainability and customer benefits.”
The sixth-generation BMW batteries:
* BMW round cells for Neue Klasse EVs
* lithium-ion batteries
NCM-cathode (a higher nickel content and reduced cobalt contend in the cathode, increased silicon content on the anode side)
LFP-cathode as a potential option
* cylindrical cell format
a standard diameter of 46 mm and two different heights: 95 and 120 mm
(4695 and 46120)
* no battery cell modules
* battery pack:
potentially structural "battery system plays a key role in the body structure of the Neue Klasse"
voltage: 800 V battery system
a much higher charging capacity with a current of up to 500 A
* availability from 2025
* general benefits:
more than 20% higher volumetric energy density
up to 30% higher driving range (WLTP)
up to 30% improved charging speed (from 10% to 80% SOC)
up to 50% lower cost on the pack level
up to 60% reduced CO2 emission from cell production (through green power and secondary material)
In the future, we might see also other battery chemistries used by BMW, as the company mentions all-solid-state batteries (ASSBs) coming by 2030 with a demonstrator vehicle before 2025.
"In parallel, the BMW Group is also pushing forward with development of all-solid-state batteries (ASSBs). The company aims to have high-voltage batteries of this type ready for series introduction by the end of the decade. The BMW Group will present a demonstrator vehicle with this technology on board well before 2025."
6 battery gigafactories
The BMW Group intends to have a total of six cylindrical battery cell gigafactories globally, each with a total capacity of up to 20 GWh annually. That would bring us to 120 GWh total.
There will be two gigafactories in each of the three main markets: Europe, China and North American free trade zone.
* six 20 GWh battery gigafactories:
Europe: 2x 20 GWh
China: 2x 20 GWh
North American free trade zone: 2x 20 GWh
* Total: 120 GWh annually
The battery plants will be built together with partners (battery manufacturers), out of which two have been already confirmed: CATL and EVE Energy. It's not a surprise, as both companies appeared in the rumors related to cylindrical battery cells for BMW.
According to BMW, CATL and EVE Energy will build two gigafatories each, one in Europe and one in China, so already four out of six projects are set to go.
* CATL: 2 gigafactories: one in Europe, one in China
* EVE Energy: 2 gigafactories: one in Europe, one in China
* other partner/partners: 2 gigafactories in North American free trade zone
* Total: six gigafactories
The third - not yet nominated - battery partner for the cylindrical cells might be Samsung SDI, which has been BMW's strategic battery supplier (prismatic cells) for many years and also is working on large cylindrical batteries. Not only that, Samsung SDI is working on round cells with 46 mm in diameter and two height versions (80 mm and a shorter version with a length between 40 mm to 60 mm), according to reports.
BMW has already awarded contracts in the two-digit billion-euro range (or USD if you wish), so the CATL and EVE Energy projects are probably underway.
"The BMW Group has already awarded contracts in the two-digit billion-euro range for production of the new BMW battery cells.
An important part of preparations to produce 46xx-type cylindrical cells will be the Cell Manufacturing Competence Centre (CMCC) in Parsdorf, near Munich in Germany. This pilot production facility will begin commissioning near-standard production of samples in late 2022.
"The pilot line at the competence centre will make it possible to analyse and fully understand the cell production process under near-standard conditions. This will help enable future suppliers produce cells to specifications and according to their own expertise – thus further optimising battery cell production with regard to quality, output and costs."
One of the strategic goals is to reduce the CO2 emission associated with the production of batteries. The group intends to achieve a 60% reduction through the use of cobalt, lithium and nickel that include a percentage of secondary material (raw materials that are not newly mined, but already in the loop). Another thing will be electricity from renewable sources.
Joachim Post, member of the Board of Management of BMW AG responsible for Purchasing and Supplier Network said:

“To meet our long-term needs, we will be building battery cell factories with our partners, each with an annual capacity of up to 20 GWh, at six locations in key markets for us: two in China, two in Europe and two in USMCA. We have also reached agreement with our partners that they will use a percentage of secondary material for the raw materials lithium, cobalt and nickel, as well as utilising green power for production, to ensure CO2-reduced manufacturing.’

Source =BMW[/Quote]

https://insideevs.com/news/609420/bm...gigafactories/

Picture of current prismatic cells versus BMW future 4580 round cells.
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      01-25-2024, 10:20 AM   #2
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There was a more recent interview with the BMW executive in charge of battery development…there was a link from this forum. They do indeed have some fascinating developments that could eventually add considerable range. Exciting times to LEASE an ev as changes will come fairly quickly in the next 6 or 7 years.
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      01-25-2024, 11:17 AM   #3
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I think it's silly to think that BMW is going to basically double the range of its cars in the next 1-2 years. Not going to happen.
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      01-25-2024, 11:45 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windshieldfarmer View Post
There was a more recent interview with the BMW executive in charge of battery development…there was a link from this forum. They do indeed have some fascinating developments that could eventually add considerable range. Exciting times to LEASE an ev as changes will come fairly quickly in the next 6 or 7 years.
Here’s the link to the Out of Spec interview with the BMW Battery engineer. It’s quite technical but I found it to be super interesting to learn about their 6th gen battery plans. This video was shot only a couple of months ago: https://youtu.be/VrDtq7LJfhs?si=yD_7Fqbl2EBzEBj2
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      01-25-2024, 12:28 PM   #5
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Thanks Daryl. As you noted much more up to date. I too am not thinking 600 miles is realistic, but if we are able to see Out of Spec Kyle and State of Charge Tom show us real drives of 400 miles in the Neue Klasse that would be exciting.

To me any number starting with a “4” would be excellent.
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      01-25-2024, 02:18 PM   #6
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Macan EV just released - 600ish KM of range, up from 350km ish range in Taycan. So - from 2020 to 2024 it has doubled almost. In next 3-4 years going to 1000km of range discussed here is entirely plausible for BMW or tech in general. I feel back for people owning EVs but not really, they will lose money on them as they upgrade but people buying those may get a very cheap EV also (but the battery disposal is another story, lets not talk about it).
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      01-25-2024, 02:20 PM   #7
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thats a high number.. love to see it, but seems optimistic. But def feel its a must to get more market share
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      01-25-2024, 02:23 PM   #8
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What’s the engine displacement? jkd

Any thread that mentions Tesla and batteries is a big turnoff.
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      01-25-2024, 02:29 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibiza View Post
What’s the engine displacement? jkd

Any thread that mentions Tesla and batteries is a big turnoff.
You must of found this tread by accident…this thread is reserved for futuristic thinkers..😊😊…cheers!
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      01-25-2024, 02:42 PM   #10
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620 miles for gen 6 range. Bring it on 👍🏻
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      01-25-2024, 02:48 PM   #11
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and price for Neue Klasse 3 series EV based on Gen 6 will be > 100K.
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      01-25-2024, 03:05 PM   #12
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I respectfully disagree. The reverse is happening on pricing differences. First we are seeing that the cost of new EV batteries is going to be 50% less. Second reflecting that and other cost efficiencies, the cost difference between ICE and EV’s for similar models which was typically about $20k, yet the Macan’s difference is in $6,050 (comparing most similar HP level’s of an ICE Macan S with an EV Macan 4). We are starting to see that price increase for EV’s declining across OEM brands, with the latest major study showing it is now under $10,000.

In order for BMW to make its planned switch to 100% EV’s and survive, that cost diff is going to have to drop even further. IMO the entry price for a Neue Klasse “3” model will be in the $75K (USD) range.
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      01-25-2024, 03:12 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest View Post
Macan EV just released - 600ish KM of range, up from 350km ish range in Taycan. So - from 2020 to 2024 it has doubled almost. In next 3-4 years going to 1000km of range discussed here is entirely plausible for BMW or tech in general. I feel back for people owning EVs but not really, they will lose money on them as they upgrade but people buying those may get a very cheap EV also (but the battery disposal is another story, lets not talk about it).
Sorry but it doesn't have 600ish km of range and comparing it to the ultra conservative range number the Taycan had is pointless ... Not the same vehicle. But the Taycan 4s (93kWh battery) was tested by Bjorn to have 425km@120km/h and 579km at 90km/h.

So range has absolutely NOT doubled from 2020 to 2024.
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      01-25-2024, 03:15 PM   #14
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This is good news :-) But it will have to be a wait and see game, if we can see ranges like this, that will make an EV sports car closer to reality. If we don't have to put in as much battery cells in them and still be able to keep around 650 km of true range that will imidietly reduce the weight of the car and costs.

EVs are going to have a enormous breakthrough sooner then later and i hope BMW is the ones who makes that breakthrough.
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      01-25-2024, 03:21 PM   #15
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In real world testing, (see Edmunds 2024 EV review), the i5 already is getting 300mile range. The i4 and iX also exceeded in range testing. This is due to the BMW not being ‘on’ when coasting. By using the same technology but stacking the cells in cylinders rather than prisms, it could conceivably double the range. Cheaper EVs just use cell pouches with ‘always on’ magnets. I expect the cost to be high, but BMW vehicles have never been budget priced, whether ICE or EV.
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      01-25-2024, 04:24 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest View Post
Macan EV just released - 600ish KM of range, up from 350km ish range in Taycan. So - from 2020 to 2024 it has doubled almost. In next 3-4 years going to 1000km of range discussed here is entirely plausible for BMW or tech in general. I feel back for people owning EVs but not really, they will lose money on them as they upgrade but people buying those may get a very cheap EV also (but the battery disposal is another story, lets not talk about it).
It’s hard to say imgine right now but there’s no reason in the future we can’t just recycle the old battery packs and replace older cars with new battery technology. I bet even 3rd party auto shops will be able do this in the next 5-6 years.
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      01-25-2024, 04:59 PM   #17
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As an owner of 2 EVs who drives around 60 miles a day and gets out of town every weekend (400 miles-ish drive) and having three 240 volt outlets in the garage and live in NE of states, I can definitely say range is overrated. The sweet spot is 320-330 miles range, you can easily live with that (even in subzero temperature) for regular daily drive and trips.
I think BMW should rather work on the look and design of the neue klasse I don’t think I can park that car proudly on my driveway!
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      01-25-2024, 05:33 PM   #18
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I agree that the Neue Klasse sedan concept could use some more pizzazz. I am also underwhelmed visually right now. Perhaps it was deliberately understated with some upside surprises planned when it is released. However the iX 3 rendered version looks better even as is. As always we need to wait for the actual BMW reveal for each of us to decide.

But if the iX 3 turns out exactly as per the below rendering and if it tests out at 400 mile range US, I would buy one when our iX lease is over (yep, another lease)..
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      01-25-2024, 06:40 PM   #19
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Finally… a 1000km range offered in a pleasurable car. Can’t wait to get feeling.
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      01-25-2024, 06:56 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NomoTesla View Post
I think it's silly to think that BMW is going to basically double the range of its cars in the next 1-2 years. Not going to happen.
Agree. It would be a bad business decision to do that even if they could at the right price. You gotta milk that cow evert step of the way.
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      01-25-2024, 08:24 PM   #21
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hey guys, I have a bridge to sell you.
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      01-25-2024, 11:01 PM   #22
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Would love to know the range in freezing temps.
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